[ppml] Transfers and Fees (was: something else, from a week ago)

[Howard, W. Lee]

I wasn't paying close attention to the thread with subject
"Policy Proposal 2007-8: Transfer Policy Clarifications" and I 
hadn't realized it had drifted into fee discussions.  As Treasurer
and chair of the Finance Committee, it's my job to make sure fees
are examined regularly.

Randy:
Suggestion for fees declining with age; I'll bring it up at a
FinCom meeting (maybe not the next one, but soon).


Daniel:
> It's possible part of the issue is the definition of "ISP." 

There may be room for a more precise definition of "ISP."  Any AC
member would be delighted to help you open that can.


Ted:
> ARIN only has one real tool to bring order to the numbering.  
> And that is charging fees.

I don't entirely agree with that.  We try not to use fees as a 
bludgeon, although I admit one of the reasons for maintenance fees
is to make sure there's somebody still at the other end.

> The fees ARIN charges are not in any way related to the "resources 
> consumed for managing IP addresses"  

That is entirely incorrect.  We charge fees to cover our expenses.
That's what the members told us to do long ago, so that's what we
do.  Members can tell us to handle fees differently; we listen.
The current structure is designed to distribute the cost roughly
in proportion to the amount of work generated.  It may not be
perfect or precise, but we balance precision against the cost of
the system.

> You charge a lot of money so that when the day comes that AOL runs 
> out of numbers and starts to use yours, and doesen't bother with 
> checking with a numbering authority to see if they are already in 
> use, you can go in front of a judge in a courtroom who doesen't know 
> an IP address from a shoelace and hold up a list of 5000 other 
> organizations who are all paying ARIN a sum total of a billion bucks 
> a year for the moral authority to tell AOL to toe the line, well then 
> as they say, when the chips are down money talks and BS walks and how 
> long do you think that AOL will be able to fight against that?

Closer to $10 million a year.
http://www.arin.net/about_us/corp_docs/budget.html
Which you'll note matches our expenses pretty closely.
2635 members (as of Fall 2006 meeting,
http://www.arin.net/meetings/minutes/ARIN_XVIII/PPT/friday/MSD_Hamlin.pp
t#270,4,Statistics: Membership Growth ) but I don't have the total
number of Orgs handy.

I don't think that moral authority can be quantified in dollars.

> we all know ARIN and the other registries are purely political
organizations

You say that like it's a bad thing.  It's a political organization 
insofar as it sets policies.  The political system used is consensus,
as judged by the AC.  


Lee