[arin-discuss] IPv4 allocation conundrum

[Michael Young]

Ryan,

You would think that would work. However, my company tried exactly that, and
both providers refused to accept the other provider's block via BGP
announcements.

We had a /24 from both. Neither provider would SWIP those blocks and show
that we were assigned them. Both required the other provider to provide, in
writing, authorization for us to announce the other provider's block.
Neither provider would give a written authorization (although both required
one). We went round and round and round. The damage done to my business was
not insignificant.

I'm not going to name names, but the providers involved are both major Tier
1 US-based ISPs.

I know this will spark a round of "they can't\shouldn't\don't do that"
emails from this list.... but they can and do. I certainly sympathize with
Mr. Carpenter. I was forced to go buy an internet pipe I didn't need for a
year just to get a /23 from a third provider. I ended up renumbering my
network three times in the span of six months. This cost us thousands of
dollars in time and lost customers. 

And each time I tried to explain my situation to someone at ARIN the
response was the same: "Well, that's the policy. We can't help you. Talk to
your upstream provider."

Michael Young
Generic Conferencing LLC


-----Original Message-----
From: arin-discuss-bounces at arin.net [mailto:arin-discuss-bounces at arin.net]
On Behalf Of Ryan Duda
Sent: Sunday, April 18, 2010 5:48 PM
To: Randy Carpenter
Cc: arin-discuss at arin.net
Subject: Re: [arin-discuss] IPv4 allocation conundrum

Randy,

This is one road..

1) Obtain an ASN, peer with Provider A and Provider B.
2) When the justification is there request an additional /24 from either 
provider A or provider B.
3) Have efficient utilization of the 2 /24's.
4) Request a /22 from ARIN


Ryan Duda
123.net
24275 Northwestern Hwy.
Southfield, MI 48075
Direct: 586.566.0564
Fax: 586.620.8005
NOC: 866.460.3503
Email: rpd at 123.net



Randy Carpenter wrote:
> They have a /24, but the ARIN policy states that if you need a /19, you
already have to have 50% of that size already fully in use. Our specific
situation is that the ISP was forced to use private IPs for purposes that
should have been public to begin with.
> 
> 
> -Randy
> 
> --
> | Randy Carpenter
> | V.P., IT Services
> | First Network Group, Inc.
> | Wapakoneta, OH
> | (419)739-9240, x1
> --
> 
> 
> ----- "Tony Hain" <alh-ietf at tndh.net> wrote:
> 
>> IANAL ... but they already have public address space assigned by
>> their
>> provider. That may only be a /32, but that is still public, and it is
>> assigned by their provider. It would likely help make the case if it
>> were a
>> static assignment, but dhcp is an assignment mechanism. YMMV
>>
>> Tony
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: arin-discuss-bounces at arin.net [mailto:arin-discuss-
>>> bounces at arin.net] On Behalf Of Randy Carpenter
>>> Sent: Friday, April 16, 2010 7:56 PM
>>> To: arin-discuss at arin.net
>>> Subject: [arin-discuss] IPv4 allocation conundrum
>>>
>>>
>>> I am working with a new customer who is in a bit of a pickle...
>>>
>>> They are an ISP and VoIP provider whose upstream provider wouldn't
>> (or
>>> couldn't) give them many addresses.
>>> They resorted to using NATed private IPs for most of their network,
>>> which is causing problems for their end user customers.
>>>
>>> Now that we are working with them, I am trying to find a solution
>> to
>>> get them public IPs. They are also soon to be multi-homed (They have
>> 2
>>> connections, but no BGP yet). As an ISP, it would be best for them
>> to
>>> have PI space.
>>>
>>> The issue is that one of the requirements for getting PI space from
>>> ARIN is that you are already using Public space that was assigned
>> to
>>> you from an upstream provider. I spoke with someone from ARIN who
>> says
>>> there is no way around this. The need around a /19 of space, and I
>>> cannot find any way to get it for them. The upstream providers
>> refuse
>>> to give them any.
>>>
>>> What can be done about this?  Would would there be a requirement of
>>> already using someone else's IP space to get your own? That seems
>> like
>>> a complete waste of time, effort, money, and IPs!
>>>
>>> -Randy
>>>
>>> --
>>> | Randy Carpenter
>>> | V.P., IT Services
>>> | First Network Group, Inc.
>>> | RHCE
>>> | (419)739-9240, x1
>>> --
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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