[arin-discuss] ARIN spammed us with "talk to the hand" ?

[Jo Rhett]

No, they didn't.  I know for a fact that most large companies have  
explicit filters that toss out anything which goes to all of the ARIN  
contact addresses.  It is always spam.

We toss it into a box where I manually report each instance of these,  
because I specifically want to nail anything abusing the ARIN whois  
database.  And lo and behold, it was ARIN correspondence in there.

On Feb 26, 2009, at 7:29 PM, Scott Leibrand wrote:
> Don't forget, every company in a position to fix this *did* get the  
> same
> e-mail you did.  I suspect they're quite aware of the issue now (if  
> they
> weren't before), and working to get it fixed.
>
> -Scott
>
> Kelvin Williams wrote:
>> Please don't take the following as me being a smarta** but this is  
>> ARIN we are talking about. Each of these service providers more  
>> than likely have a direct allocation, and therefore ARIN has  
>> quality contact information for them.
>>
>> When Joe the IP Engineer calls Google he doesn't get anything but  
>> an IVR that instructs him to submit an email or web form. Which is  
>> ignored. We've done this.
>>
>> However if Google's (and, I apologize in advance for using them in  
>> my example) designated ARIN contact receives a notice from ARIN,  
>> I'm willing to bet he or she is more apt to respond.
>>
>> So why does David have to fight Goliath's battle?
>>
>> Kw
>>
>>
>> Kelvin Williams
>> Altus Communications Group, Inc.
>> Office Direct: 678.369.5968
>> Office Main: 678.369.5970
>> Fax: 866.895.8557
>> Mobile: 678.852.4173
>>
>> Sent from my BlackBerry® smartphone with SprintSpeed
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: "Scott Berkman" <scott.berkman at reignmaker.net>
>>
>> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 22:02:03
>> To: 'Kelvin Williams'<kwilliams at altuscgi.com>; <arin- 
>> discuss at arin.net>
>> Subject: RE: [arin-discuss] ARIN spammed us with "talk to the hand" ?
>>
>>
>> My best guess is this is exactly what they were trying to avoid.  I  
>> bet it
>> they have been getting inundated themselves with calls/emails about  
>> these
>> issues, but can't actually fix it since they don't control their  
>> services.
>>
>> I'd do something similar if my customers were flooding us about an  
>> issue
>> that wasn't our fault and we couldn't fix on our own.
>>
>> Not saying they couldn't have had a better, more helpful email, but  
>> I get
>> why they sent it.
>>
>> 	-Scott
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: arin-discuss-bounces at arin.net [mailto:arin-discuss-bounces at arin.net 
>> ]
>> On Behalf Of Kelvin Williams
>> Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 9:55 PM
>> To: arin-discuss at arin.net
>> Subject: Re: [arin-discuss] ARIN spammed us with "talk to the hand" ?
>>
>> I would have to concur.  As a current holder of a block in the  
>> affected
>> ranges our helpdesk has been inundated with complaint calls from our
>> end-users.  For example, Google redirects our users with IPs in the
>> affected
>> ranges to their German version, etc.
>>
>> While we haven't experienced any true routing issues, we have tried  
>> to
>> contact some of the content providers and companies like Google to no
>> avail.
>>
>>
>> At the bare minimum, ARIN could have provided to block holders via  
>> the new
>> superduper secure website contact numbers or e-mail addresses to the
>> organizations which we know are causing these types of issues.  We  
>> have
>> all
>> but abandoned any hopes of resolving the issue and merely crossed our
>> fingers in hopes that these content and geo-location providers would
>> re-query ARIN's WHOIS at some time in the immediate future.
>>
>> I can't speak for all, but at our company, we don't have anyone  
>> available
>> to
>> research for contacts, fill out web-forms-to-nowhere, or leave  
>> voicemails
>> all day in mailboxes that don't get checked.
>>
>> kw
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: arin-discuss-bounces at arin.net [mailto:arin-discuss-bounces at arin.net 
>> ]
>> On Behalf Of Sean Cheesman
>> Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 9:40 PM
>> To: Scott Leibrand; Jo Rhett
>> Cc: arin-discuss at arin.net
>> Subject: Re: [arin-discuss] ARIN spammed us with "talk to the hand" ?
>>
>> I disagree that this was a reasonable statement from ARIN.  They  
>> listed no
>> examples of what "content providers" are causing problems, and only  
>> leave
>> it
>> up to us to determine if there is a problem, and then try to  
>> resolve it on
>> our own.  Yes, it may now be easier to troubleshoot a problem  
>> because now
>> I
>> may say "hey, didn't I get an email from ARIN a while back warning  
>> me of a
>> problem?" but that doesn't really help me be proactive about the  
>> issue.
>>
>> Sean
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: arin-discuss-bounces at arin.net [mailto:arin-discuss-bounces at arin.net 
>> ]
>> On Behalf Of Scott Leibrand
>> Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 9:36 PM
>> To: Jo Rhett
>> Cc: arin-discuss at arin.net
>> Subject: Re: [arin-discuss] ARIN spammed us with "talk to the hand" ?
>>
>> Jo,
>>
>> I was not involved in any discussions around that notice, but when  
>> I got
>> it, I interpreted it as saying, "We're aware of a problem, and  
>> believe
>> it may affect a lot of you.  We can't fix it for you, but here's what
>> you need to know to get it fixed if you're affected."
>>
>> Quite reasonable, IMO.
>>
>> -Scott
>>
>> Jo Rhett wrote:
>>
>>> Can someone explain to me why ARIN spammed all of our ARIN contacts
>>> (including (A)buse contacts!) with a notice that says "talk to the
>>> hand" ?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> If you or your peers experience any of these types of problems, you
>>>> are
>>>> encouraged to contact and work with third-party information  
>>>> software
>>>> vendors
>>>> and/or the content providers directly to effect changes.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> If ARIN can not and will not do anything to contact these parties  
>>> and
>>> get it resolved, why does it send a notice telling us with this?   
>>> Next
>>> week will we see a notice that ARIN won't be involved in saving
>>> starving children in Africa?  I imagine that ARIN will be very busy
>>> informing us of every thing it does not plan to work on ... is this
>>> helpful?  Honestly?
>>>
>>> Entire message below:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Per a request from an ARIN customer, ARIN is sending you this  
>>>> letter
>>>> as
>>>> a courtesy notification of problems some registrants of ARIN-issued
>>>> IPv4
>>>> addresses have experienced.
>>>>
>>>> Some geolocation and content providers are misidentifying ARIN- 
>>>> issued
>>>> address space as being outside the ARIN region. Common problems
>>>> experienced
>>>> by ARIN registrants over the last two years include:
>>>>
>>>> - search engines misidentifying the addresses as being in South
>>>> America;
>>>> - content caching providers sending traffic via nodes in South
>>>> America; and
>>>> - e-commerce transactions failing or being delaying due to fraud
>>>> prevention
>>>> procedures being triggered when the payment processing system
>>>> believes the
>>>> transaction is originating in South America.
>>>>
>>>> Registrants have experienced these problems both with new IANA-
>>>> issued /8s
>>>> (like 173.0.0.0/8 and 174.0.0.0/8) and with /8s which ARIN has
>>>> issued and
>>>> re-issued over many years (like 63.0.0.0/8).
>>>>
>>>> If you or your peers experience any of these types of problems, you
>>>> are
>>>> encouraged to contact and work with third-party information  
>>>> software
>>>> vendors
>>>> and/or the content providers directly to effect changes.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Leslie Nobile
>>>> Director, Registration Services
>>>> American Registry for Internet Numbers
>>>>
>>>>
>> _______________________________________________
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> _______________________________________________
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-- 
Jo Rhett
senior geek

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