[ARIN-consult] Community Consultation on IRR Route Validation. attorney client communication.

Tue Mar 31 16:28:08 EDT 2015

AS 32787 and AS 20940 will continue to use and expand use of RADB for the foreseeable future. 

Best,

-M<

> On Mar 19, 2015, at 10:34 AM, John Curran <jcurran at arin.net> wrote:
> 
> ARIN-Consult Community - 
> 
>    For clarity, ARIN's General Counsel Steve Ryan was responding to the question
>    "Why should anybody else then Microsoft, be allowed to create route-objects 
>    that cover Microsoft space?" that was being asked, as it seemed to be 
>    soliciting some detailed information about Microsoft's business & services.
> 
>    Folks are free to provide information about whether their company would
>    find specific ARIN services useful or not, but refrain from questioning 
>    each other (even incidentally) about your business plans and service 
>    details, as in some contexts questions those are sort of question that 
>    can raise anti-trust issues.
> 
>    In this particular case, Job was just pointing out the rather wide-open 
>    nature of the present IRR service and anyone's ability to add objects,
>    not really asking Microsoft specifics of its plans...   It's good to see 
>    the our General Counsel in action, and his diligence in picking up on a 
>    remark that without clear context could be the sort that raises concern.
> 
>    Please continue to discuss merits and issues with the present IRR services 
>    and possible future direction - it has been most informative.  :-)
> 
> Thanks!
> /John
> 
> John Curran
> President and CEO
> ARIN
> 
>> On Mar 18, 2015, at 11:41 AM, Ryan, Stephen <SRyan at mwe.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Counsel's Note:
>> 
>> Participants in this discussion are respectfully requested and  directed to confine the discussion to 'policy' issues. The reference to individual plans of a company, i.e. MS here,  are unwelcome unless absolutely necessary, something I cannot yet  judge. Please exercise caution and refrain from references to the business plans of individual companies.
>> 
>> Steve Ryan
>> 
>> Stephen M. Ryan
>> Partner
>> McDermott Will & Emery LLP
>> The McDermott Building | 500 North Capitol Street, N.W. | Washington, DC 20001
>> Tel +1 202 756 8333
>> Mobile +1 202 251 5343
>> Fax +1 202 756 8087
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>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: arin-consult-bounces at arin.net [mailto:arin-consult-bounces at arin.net] On Behalf Of Job Snijders
>> Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2015 11:36 AM
>> To: David Huberman
>> Cc: arin-consult at arin.net
>> Subject: Re: [ARIN-consult] Community Consultation on IRR Route Validation
>> 
>> Hi David,
>> 
>> On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 01:15:37PM +0000, David Huberman wrote:
>>> My viewpoint is AS8075 will not use it.  Like hundreds|thousands of
>>> others operators, we use RADB (a paid service with an SLA that works)
>>> for our IRR entries.
>> 
>> Which part works? You realise that anybody can register anything for any prefix in RADB right? ARIN now has a chance to step their game up and make it possible to offer better quality data.
>> 
>> Why should anybody else then Microsoft, be allowed to create route-objects that cover Microsoft space?
>> 
>>> My viewpoint is ARIN should not offer an IRR anymore, as there is too
>>> much garbage data in it, and the cost of re-development efforts
>>> strongly outweighs the benefits to the operational community.
>> 
>> This is one example how RADB can be abused:
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.bgpmon.net_using-2Dbgp-2Ddata-2Dto-2Dfind-2Dspammers_&d=AwICAg&c=96ZbZZcaMF4w0F4jpN6LZg&r=XDN_BIPGnpb6V0w5M9FADw&m=XtXSprAaWeMBEhujNfH3sjTUY70nIP1Bpm0voLpIkh4&s=WJXYf7V-2XT2iOEIjVCeGkFHjR7ZZPx29s6LqWo3A9k&e= 
>> 
>> Tying together RIR & IRR data allows operators to programmatically assess which parts of IRR we subsume into route-filters, and which parts we ignore because there is zero guarantee that the information is authorised.
>> 
>> Third party IRRs like RADB (or NTTCOM) cannot verify who is authorised to create route-objects or not.
>> 
>> Regarding cost: ARIN could be the fourth RIR to do RIR<>IRR coupling, after, other RIRs who offer this today: Afrinic, APNIC & RIPE. This is not a new concept and code already exists. An undertaking like this of course has a pricetag, however I'd be hesitant to claim that the cost will outweight the benefits.
>> 
>> Kind regards,
>> 
>> Job
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