[arin-ppml] Beneficial Owners

Mike Burns mike at iptrading.com
Fri Jul 13 10:10:05 EDT 2018 

+1 to William’s sentiments

 

Regards,
Mike

 

From: ARIN-PPML [mailto:arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net] On Behalf Of william manning
Sent: Friday, July 13, 2018 9:26 AM
To: Roberts, Orin <oroberts at bell.ca>
Cc: ARIN-PPML List <arin-ppml at arin.net>
Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Beneficial Owners

 

I think the example, (2014, DE shell, owned by proscribed parties, gets stewardship of resources, ARIN <should> due diligence on beneficial owners)  has ARIN over-reaching the State of Delaware and the IRS/Treasury.   If a legal entity passes documentation muster (as JC pointed out) then ARIN is obliged/compelled to follow its policies.  In the case of suspect behaviours, DE can cancel the corporate registration and the IRS/Treas can sequester assets & block transactions.  I believe a court could instruct ARIN to recover or assign resources.   ARIN <IMnsHO> should stick to its knitting.  ARIN <currently> has no business in maintaing a DNA registry of all natural persons who may have been associated in a transaction with ARIN over resource assignments and use that registry in cooperation with global LEA to catch perps.  

I hope ARIN never goes there.

 

/Wm

 

On Fri, Jul 13, 2018 at 5:31 AM, Roberts, Orin <oroberts at bell.ca <mailto:oroberts at bell.ca> > wrote:

I am assuming Ronald is aware of this.

https://www.arin.net/knowledge/rirs/ARINcountries.html

ARIN's geographical service area includes all of the countries in the list below. 
Complete List of Countries in the ARIN Region
Canada Sector   A 2     A 3     Region
CANADA  CA      CAN     ARIN
Caribbean and North Atlantic Islands Sector     A 2     A 3     Region
ANGUILLA        AI      AIA     ARIN
ANTIGUA AND BARBUDA     AG      ATG     ARIN
BAHAMAS BS      BHS     ARIN
BARBADOS        BB      BRB     ARIN
BERMUDA BM      BMU     ARIN
CAYMAN ISLANDS  KY      CYM     ARIN
DOMINICA        DM      DMA     ARIN
GRENADA GD      GRD     ARIN
GUADELOUPE      GP      GLP     ARIN
JAMAICA JM      JAM     ARIN
MARTINIQUE      MQ      MTQ     ARIN
MONTSERRAT      MS      MSR     ARIN
SAINT BARTHELEMY        BL      BLM     ARIN
SAINT KITTS AND NEVIS   KN      KNA     ARIN
SAINT LUCIA     LC      LCA     ARIN
ST. PIERRE AND MIQUELON PM      SPM     ARIN
SAINT VINCENT AND THE GRENADINES        VC      VCT     ARIN
ST. MARTIN      MF      MAF     ARIN
TURKS AND CAICOS ISLANDS        TC      TCA     ARIN
VIRGIN ISLANDS (BRITISH)        VG      VGB     ARIN
United States Sector    A 2     A 3     Region
UNITED STATES   US      USA     ARIN
PUERTO RICO
PR      PRI     ARIN
VIRGIN ISLANDS (U.S.)
VI      VIR     ARIN
UNITED STATES MINOR OUTLYING ISLANDS
UM      UMI     ARIN
Outlying Areas Sector   A 2     A 3     Region
ANTARCTICA      AQ      ATA     ARIN
BOUVET ISLAND   BV      BVT     ARIN
HEARD AND MC DONALD ISLANDS     HM      HMD     ARIN
ST. HELENA      SH      SHN     ARIN





Orin Roberts




-----Original Message-----
From: ARIN-PPML <arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net <mailto:arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net> > On Behalf Of Keith W. Hare
Sent: July-13-18 7:50 AM
To: Ronald F. Guilmette <rfg at tristatelogic.com <mailto:rfg at tristatelogic.com> >; ARIN-PPML List <arin-ppml at arin.net <mailto:arin-ppml at arin.net> >
Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Beneficial Owners

Ronald,

In answer to your question 

    I would like to know if there is, or would be, 
    general hostility to the notion of ARIN asking for
    concrete documentation of the identities of the beneficial
    owners (say, for 25% ownership or above) of non-publicly-traded 
    corporate entities to which ARIN assigns number resources.

I don't know about general hostility, but I personally am hostile to this notion.

I have a couple of reasons:

1. As a small company, we have better things to do than provide more documentation.
2. This looks a lot like a search for a problem in hopes of suggesting that the problem exists rather than a response to a real problem.

Keith


-----Original Message-----
From: ARIN-PPML [mailto:arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net <mailto:arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net> ] On Behalf Of Ronald F. Guilmette
Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2018 5:36 PM
To: ARIN-PPML List <arin-ppml at arin.net <mailto:arin-ppml at arin.net> >
Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Beneficial Owners


In message <CAC4yj2X+hS4rjyCHiLagk9AQVWa3ZFYvs_0O2gE12YVXO2genA at mail.gmail.com <mailto:CAC4yj2X%2BhS4rjyCHiLagk9AQVWa3ZFYvs_0O2gE12YVXO2genA at mail.gmail.com> >
Jason Schiller <jschiller at google.com <mailto:jschiller at google.com> > wrote:

>I know neither of these directly answer your question.

Well, in a word, no.  but I appreciate your response as it does shed a bit more light on this overall topic.

Of course, I have no real idea what the exact meaning of this phrase is:
"provided that the applicant has a real and substantial connection with the ARIN region".  But that's OK, because I don't imagine that anybody else has either, and I intuit that this exact squishy phraseology was made a part of ARIN-2015-5 rather deliberately, to insure general acceptance of the larger proposal.

To return to my original point however, I would like to know if there is, or would be, general hostility to the notion of ARIN asking for concrete documentation of the identities of the beneficial owners (say, for 25% ownership or above) of non-publicly-traded corporate entities to which ARIN assigns number resources.

As should be evident, in the current era, and given the various shenanigans, political and otherwise, that have dogged the Internet generally in recent years, I personally am of the opinion that additional transparency is not only warranted but necessary, even if for no other reason than to fully comply with both the letter and the spirit of existing law and various international sanction regimes.
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