[arin-ppml] ARIN-PPML 2017-8

Rudolph Daniel rudi.daniel at gmail.com
Mon Aug 28 14:01:52 EDT 2017


Support changing the definition of community networks.

'The community network's focus should be providing connectivity
rather than achieving a profit'
Jos?

I am still absorbing the isoc language, but  'profit' is not the correct
terminology for a not- profit....maybe 'excess' ??

RD
On Aug 27, 2017 9:45 PM, <arin-ppml-request at arin.net> wrote:

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> Today's Topics:
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>    1. Re: Revised: Draft Policy ARIN-2017-8: Amend the Definition
>       of Community Network (Carlton Samuels)
>    2. Re: Expanding Scope? :Draft Policy ARIN-2017-8: Amend the
>       definition of Community Network (Jose R. de la Cruz III)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2017 10:00:06 -0500
> From: Carlton Samuels <carlton.samuels at gmail.com>
> To: ARIN <info at arin.net>
> Cc: arin-ppml at arin.net
> Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Revised: Draft Policy ARIN-2017-8: Amend the
>         Definition of Community Network
> Message-ID:
>         <CAOZQb9T21ZMJoNOC61gGvGZ4OgqcjbLAEAOadEsYvXWb5M+zpg at mail.
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>
> I support this change to the definition of community networks.
>
> -Carlton Samuels
>
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> ==============================
> *Carlton A Samuels*
>
> *Mobile: 876-818-1799Strategy, Planning, Governance, Assessment &
> Turnaround*
> =============================
>
> On Thu, Aug 24, 2017 at 10:22 AM, ARIN <info at arin.net> wrote:
>
> > The following has been revised:
> >
> > * Draft Policy ARIN-2017-8: Amend the Definition of Community Network
> >
> > Revised text is below and can be found at:
> > https://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/2017_8.html
> >
> > You are encouraged to discuss all Draft Policies on PPML. The AC will
> > evaluate the discussion in order to assess the conformance of this draft
> > policy with ARIN's Principles of Internet number resource policy as
> stated
> > in the Policy Development Process (PDP). Specifically, these principles
> are:
> >
> > * Enabling Fair and Impartial Number Resource Administration
> > * Technically Sound
> > * Supported by the Community
> >
> > The PDP can be found at:
> > https://www.arin.net/policy/pdp.html
> >
> > Draft Policies and Proposals under discussion can be found at:
> > https://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/index.html
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Sean Hopkins
> > Policy Analyst
> > American Registry for Internet Numbers (ARIN)
> >
> >
> >
> > Draft Policy ARIN-2017-8: Amend the Definition of Community Network
> >
> > Problem Statement:
> >
> > The Community Networks section of the NRPM has not been used since
> > implementation in January 2010. Proposal ARIN-2016-7, to increase the
> > number of use cases, was abandoned by the Advisory Council due to lack of
> > feedback. Proposal ARIN 2017-2, to remove all mention of community
> networks
> > from NRPM was met with opposition by the community. Many responded that
> the
> > definition of ?community network? was too narrow, which could be the
> reason
> > for lack of uptake.
> >
> > Policy statement:
> >
> > CURRENT NRPM TEXT:
> >
> > ?2.11. Community Network
> >
> > A community network is any network organized and operated by a volunteer
> > group operating as or under the fiscal support of a nonprofit
> organization
> > or university for the purpose of providing free or low-cost connectivity
> to
> > the residents of their local service area. To be treated as a community
> > network under ARIN policy, the applicant must certify to ARIN that the
> > community network staff is 100% volunteers.?
> >
> > NEW NRPM TEXT:
> >
> > ?2.11 Community Network
> >
> > A community network is a network organized and operated by a volunteer
> > group, not-for-profit, non-profit, charitable organization, or
> educational
> > institution for the purpose of providing free or low-cost connectivity,
> or
> > other Information Technology services to persons or entities within their
> > community. Critical functions may be handled by paid staff, but
> volunteers
> > play a large role in offering services available through community
> > networks.?
> >
> > Comments:
> >
> > Timetable for implementation: Immediate
> > _______________________________________________
> > PPML
> > You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
> > the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (ARIN-PPML at arin.net).
> > Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
> > http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml
> > Please contact info at arin.net if you experience any issues.
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2017 21:45:11 -0400
> From: "Jose R. de la Cruz III" <jrdelacruz at acm.org>
> To: David Farmer <farmer at umn.edu>
> Cc: "arin-ppml at arin.net" <arin-ppml at arin.net>
> Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Expanding Scope? :Draft Policy ARIN-2017-8:
>         Amend the definition of Community Network
> Message-ID:
>         <CAKrxPqf=m_DBz-xhwBsdtbgZmcXygY=s9BGMgkGxfv6w
> vdAMxA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> David:
>
> ISOC proposes that "*Community networks, communications infrastructure
> deployed and operated by citizens to meet their own communication needs*" (
> http://www.internetsociety.org/what-we-do/community-networks).
>
> The problem is *if* ARIN should support this connectivity initiative, and
> *how*. The community network's focus should be providing connectivity
> rather than achieving a profit. The definition is the problem, as
> identifying a "proper" community network will allow to work on a real
> solution.
>
> Jos? R. de la Cruz
> jrdelacruz at acm.org
>
> On Fri, Aug 25, 2017 at 9:42 AM, David Farmer <farmer at umn.edu> wrote:
>
> > Ok, then I need to hear from others in the community on the subject
> > expanding the scope of the problem statement for this Draft Policy beyond
> > the just the Definition of Community Networks at this point;
> >
> > Should we revise the problem statement beyond it's current scope?
> >
> > If yes, then what should the revised problem statement include?
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > On Thu, Aug 24, 2017 at 11:19 PM, Kevin Blumberg <kevinb at thewire.ca>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> David,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I see that the revised text addresses some of the definition issues.
> >> Regarding your question I believe that the definition and section 6.5.9
> are
> >> intrinsically tied together.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Currently the only active part of Community Networks is the state that
> it
> >> will be considered an end-user regarding ?all ARIN purposes?. I have an
> >> issue if this is used by Organizations to act as a way of opting-out of
> >> SWIP requirements. With a substantially expanded definition the number
> of
> >> Organizations that could use the policy is significant.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Another interesting problem comes from the new Registration Services
> Plan
> >> (https://www.arin.net/fees/fee_schedule.html)
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ?Organizations that choose to convert to the Registration Services Plan
> >> will be evaluated as an ISP from a policy perspective when requesting
> >> future Internet number resources from ARIN. The applicable annual
> >> registration services plan will be invoiced annually based on the
> >> organization resources in the ARIN registry.?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Kevin Blumberg
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> *From:* David Farmer [mailto:farmer at umn.edu]
> >> *Sent:* Thursday, August 24, 2017 3:05 PM
> >> *To:* Kevin Blumberg <kevinb at thewire.ca>
> >> *Cc:* arin-ppml at arin.net
> >> *Subject:* Re: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2017-8: Amend the
> >> definition of Community Network
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Kevin,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> There was a little confusion, mostly on my part it seems. Cutting to the
> >> chase; An older version of the text got sent out with the announcement
> of
> >> this policy. An updated version of text got sent out earlier today, it
> >> addresses some but for sure not all of your points.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> As for several of the broader points you bring up, I'd like to work on
> >> updating the definition for Community Networks first, mostly because
> that
> >> is the scope of the problem statement focuses on. Once we develop some
> >> consensus around a new definition for Community Networks, then I think
> we
> >> could build on that and look at some of the broader issues you bring up.
> >> Would that plan work for you?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Wed, Aug 23, 2017 at 2:22 PM, Kevin Blumberg <kevinb at thewire.ca>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> I do not support the policy as written but do support the overall
> intent.
> >>
> >> 1) The definition of a community network has gone from overly specific
> to
> >> overly broad. An example in Canada there are over 160,000 non-profit and
> >> not-for-profit organizations.
> >> 2) A volunteer group, that is not an organization, wouldn't be able to
> >> get space from ARIN as it requires a business registration (ARIN Staff
> >> please confirm).
> >> 3) Why is there a limit to only post-secondary institutions? Many rural
> >> locations have K-12 that would not qualify.
> >> 4) In Canada, a charity is a non-profit organization, more generic terms
> >> should be used that covers the entire ARIN serving region.
> >> 5) The current Community Networks policy conflicts with the intent of
> >> 2017-5 Improved IPv6 Registration Requirements. By placing all space
> into
> >> End User assignment, Community Networks operating as a ISP collective
> for
> >> residential subscribers would be unable to reassign static assignments.
> >>
> >> The current Community Networks policy requires an applicant to qualify
> >> under standard end-user requirements (Section 6.5.9.2).  If there is no
> >> difference to the qualification criteria, why would an organization go
> out
> >> of the way to qualify as a Community Network?
> >>
> >> I wrote a policy in 2016 that tried to address some of these issues, it
> >> was abandoned at the time ( https://www.arin.net/policy/pr
> >> oposals/2016_7.html )
> >>
> >> Kevin Blumberg
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: ARIN-PPML [mailto:arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net] On Behalf Of ARIN
> >> Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 12:40 PM
> >> To: arin-ppml at arin.net
> >> Subject: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2017-8: Amend the definition of
> >> Community Network
> >>
> >> On 17 August 2017 the ARIN Advisory Council (AC) advanced
> >> "ARIN-prop-243: Amend the Definition of Community Network" to Draft
> >> Policy status.
> >>
> >> Draft Policy ARIN-2017-8 is below and can be found at:
> >> https://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/2017_8.html
> >>
> >> You are encouraged to discuss all Draft Policies on PPML. The AC will
> >> evaluate the discussion in order to assess the conformance of this draft
> >> policy with ARIN's Principles of Internet number resource policy as
> stated
> >> in the Policy Development Process (PDP). Specifically, these principles
> are:
> >>
> >> * Enabling Fair and Impartial Number Resource Administration
> >> * Technically Sound
> >> * Supported by the Community
> >>
> >> The PDP can be found at:
> >> https://www.arin.net/policy/pdp.html
> >>
> >> Draft Policies and Proposals under discussion can be found at:
> >> https://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/index.html
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> Sean Hopkins
> >> Policy Analyst
> >> American Registry for Internet Numbers (ARIN)
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Draft Policy ARIN-2017-8: Amend the Definition of Community Network
> >>
> >> Problem Statement:
> >>
> >> The Community Networks section of the NRPM has not been used since
> >> implementation in January 2010. Proposal ARIN-2016-7, to increase the
> >> number of use cases, was abandoned by the Advisory Council due to lack
> of
> >> feedback. Proposal ARIN 2017-2, to remove all mention of community
> networks
> >> from NRPM was met with opposition by the community. Many responded that
> the
> >> definition of ?community network? was too narrow, which could be the
> reason
> >> for lack of uptake.
> >>
> >> Policy statement:
> >>
> >> CURRENT NRPM TEXT:
> >>
> >> ?2.11. Community Network
> >>
> >> A community network is any network organized and operated by a volunteer
> >> group operating as or under the fiscal support of a nonprofit
> organization
> >> or university for the purpose of providing free or low-cost
> connectivity to
> >> the residents of their local service area. To be treated as a community
> >> network under ARIN policy, the applicant must certify to ARIN that the
> >> community network staff is 100% volunteers.?
> >>
> >> NEW NRPM TEXT:
> >>
> >> ?2.11 Community Network
> >>
> >> A community network is a network organized and operated by a volunteer
> >> group, not-for-profit, non-profit, charitable organization, or
> >> post-secondary institution for the purpose of providing free or low-cost
> >> connectivity to residents in their service area. Critical functions may
> be
> >> handled by paid staff, but volunteers play a large role in offering
> >> services available through community networks.?
> >>
> >> Comments:
> >>
> >> Timetable for implementation: Immediate
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> PPML
> >> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to the ARIN
> >> Public Policy Mailing List (ARIN-PPML at arin.net).
> >> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
> >> http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml
> >> Please contact info at arin.net if you experience any issues.
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> PPML
> >> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
> >> the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (ARIN-PPML at arin.net).
> >> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
> >> http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml
> >> Please contact info at arin.net if you experience any issues.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> ===============================================
> >> David Farmer               Email:farmer at umn.edu
> >> Networking & Telecommunication Services
> >> Office of Information Technology
> >> University of Minnesota
> >> 2218 University Ave SE        Phone: 612-626-0815 <(612)%20626-0815>
> >> Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029   Cell: 612-812-9952 <(612)%20812-9952>
> >> ===============================================
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > ===============================================
> > David Farmer               Email:farmer at umn.edu
> > Networking & Telecommunication Services
> > Office of Information Technology
> > University of Minnesota
> > 2218 University Ave SE        Phone: 612-626-0815 <(612)%20626-0815>
> > Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029   Cell: 612-812-9952 <(612)%20812-9952>
> > ===============================================
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > PPML
> > You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
> > the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (ARIN-PPML at arin.net).
> > Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
> > http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml
> > Please contact info at arin.net if you experience any issues.
> >
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