[arin-ppml] Policy Proposal Idea: Reassignment records for IPv4 End-Users

Tue Jul 14 16:16:29 EDT 2015

Well, this proposal scares me..

Similar to what is alluded to below, ARIN has a hard enough time getting 
the ISP's to properly SWIP usage..

And allowing end users to SWIP might even set the stage for more abuse.

I could see spammers changing the SWIP daily to their advantage.. (oh, 
that was a different guy) even if they had to pay.

We already have a 'rwhois' system that can be used to address the 
problem suggested.. No reason why an ISP can't create a 'rwhois' system 
for their customers

And yes, needs justification in this case, it would increase the ARIN 
workload I believe..

I think ARIN just has to put more teeth into getting members to use 
proper 'rwhois' first..

On 15-07-14 01:05 PM, Mike Burns wrote:
> I wonder if SWIPped addresses would be a sufficient display of utilization, or would ARIN need to investigate the SWIPped blocks more deeply to ensure utilization ratio of the "parent" end-user, if that end-user comes to ARIN looking to buy addresses and has to justify their purchase?
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net [mailto:arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net] On Behalf Of Bill Buhler
> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2015 3:59 PM
> To: arin-ppml at arin.net
> Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Policy Proposal Idea: Reassignment records for IPv4 End-Users
>
> As a IPv4 end user I can understand why some would want this ability, but we have no desire to do such. What if instead policy would allow end users to either elect to be treated as a ISP, or pay a fee to have access to SWIP? This would be similar to how voting rights are allocated now.  BTW one right I would love to have by default would be a vote without paying an additional fee, but that is of course another topic.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Bill Buhler
> TeKnowledgy, Inc. | Curing IT headaches since 2009
> 675 East 2100 South, Suite 110
> Salt Lake City, Utah 84106
> 385-202-7100 office
> 385-202-7101 direct / mobile
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net [mailto:arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net] On Behalf Of Andrew Dul
> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2015 1:12 PM
> To: Gary T. Giesen; 'Andrew Dul'; arin-ppml at arin.net
> Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Policy Proposal Idea: Reassignment records for IPv4 End-Users
>
> The intention is to allow for end-users to be able to add reassignment records to the database.  As noted in the policy proposal, this idea has an impact of the fee categories, because the ability to add reassignment records traditionally has been one of the differences between ISPs and end-users.
>
> I think we need to consider if the categories of IPv4 ISP and end-users have any significance now that the IPv4 free pool has been exhausted.
>
> I will let ARIN staff comment on the cost/workload aspects of this change idea.
>
> The fees themselves are the purview of the board.  Since this policy changes the service levels that ARIN would provide to end-users one might expect that the fee levels might change for organizations which choose to take advantage of the additional functionality.
>
> Andrew
>
> On 7/14/2015 8:08 AM, Gary T. Giesen wrote:
>> Andrew,
>>
>> Is it your intention to create a single class of users (ie. no more End-User vs ISP), or maintain the distinction? I'd like to see end-users be able to SWIP, but I'd don't want to see their costs increase because of it. Also, ISPs will argue if end-users can SWIP (which is probably the biggest technical distinction between the two right now ) and pay far less, they'll either argue their fees should be lowered, the end users fees should be raised, or try to game the system by applying as end-users.
>>
>> Do we have any indication from ARIN staff as to what the implications in terms of cost/workload would be if end-users would be allowed to SWIP? Again, if the impact is minimal (ie no raising of end-user fees) and sufficient language was put around who they could SWIP to (ie only organizations in which the parent owns a controlling share, etc) then I would support this.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> GTG
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net [mailto:arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net]
>>> On Behalf Of Andrew Dul
>>> Sent: July 13, 2015 11:31 AM
>>> To: arin-ppml at arin.net
>>> Subject: [arin-ppml] Policy Proposal Idea: Reassignment records for
>>> IPv4 End- Users
>>>
>>> The AC has been discussing the following ideas on their list and I
>>> have drafted the following policy proposal as an outcome.  We are
>>> posting the ideas and proposal here to PPML for community discussion.
>>> This draft has not been submitted formally to the PDP process at this
>>> point.  I believed having initial feedback from the community before
>>> submitting would be a valuable addition before going into the formal process.
>>>
>>> You comments are welcome.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Andrew
>>>
>>>
>>> ====
>>>
>>> Template: ARIN-POLICY-PROPOSAL-TEMPLATE-3.0
>>>
>>> 1.    Policy Proposal Name: Reassignment records for IPv4 End-Users
>>>
>>> 4.    Problem Statement:
>>>
>>> End-User Organizations do not have the ability to create reassignment
>>> records in the number resource database.
>>>
>>> Reassignment records can be used for a number of different functions
>>> which could benefit the overall desire to increase database accuracy
>>> by allowing organizations to add additional details in the database.
>>>
>>> The following reasons have been noted as positive reasons to allow
>>> the creation of additional records.
>>> -    Geolocation (allows an organization to specify a different location
>>> within the database which is used by organizations creating
>>> geo-location by IP address databases)
>>> -    Subsidiary reassignment (allows an organization to note that a
>>> portion of their netblock is in use by a different subsidiary entity)
>>> -    Assignment to contracted parties (some organizations have contracts
>>> with other organizations which are operating networks under
>>> agreements with the registrant, this allows the top-level
>>> organizations to accurately specify the organization operating the
>>> network in the number resource
>>> database)
>>> -    More specific contact information (some organizations operate large
>>> networks which don’t necessarily have the same technical or abuse
>>> contact
>>> information)
>>>
>>>

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