[arin-ppml] Internet 101: Collaboration (was - Microsoft receives court approval for transfer as agreed with ARIN)

[Owen DeLong]

On Apr 29, 2011, at 5:40 PM, David Conrad wrote:

> John,
> 
> On Apr 29, 2011, at 3:22 PM, John Curran wrote:
>> Someone can claim they've "sold" something to someone, but there's 
>> no delivery until there's a valid transfer request to be processed 
>> at ARIN.
> 
> So there is no registry but ARIN's registry.  An interesting point of view that I'm certain will be tested in the near future.  
> 
>> Remember: ARIN "gets in the way" because the community has directed us to implement these policies.  
> 
> For some definition of the term "the community".  See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias
> 
>>> 1) spend resources (time, money, people) on joining the ARIN debating and fine lunch and dinner club with uncertain prospects for positive outcomes
>> 
>> That's called participation in the policy development process, 
>> and that is an essential principle of the system.
> 
> To me it clearly wasn't for Nortel/Microsoft but I understand you see things differently.
> 
>>> 2) spend resources (time, money, people) on suing ARIN with uncertain (but higher probability based on the two existing precedents) for positive outcomes
>> 
>> Actually, I'm quite certain of the results based on history. 
>> Until there's a request that meets the community developed 
>> policy, we do not change the registry.  Neither of the past
>> cases resulted in an order to update the registry. 
> 
> True, there was no order to 'update the registry'.
> 
> In Kremens v. ARIN, statute of limitations expired, but as far as I'm aware the previous judgement that awarded Cohen's address space to Kremens wasn't vacated.  Maybe it was and I missed it or maybe Kremens decided to play along or maybe there is a bit of a divergence in how the US courts view the world and how ARIN's One True Registry views the world (in which case that address space is presumably lost to the sands of time).  I've no idea what the current state of affairs is.
> 
There was a point where Kremens sought to get the transfer completed without an
agreement with ARIN. The judge specifically ruled that his ruling was not intended
to bypass ARIN's process and that the RSA was a perfectly reasonable requirement
for ARIN to place on Kremens to complete the transfer.

I don't have the documents to point to, but, I was in the court room when the judge
said that.


Owen