[arin-discuss] IPv4 allocation conundrum

[Jacob Epstein]

Hi Randy,

I am in a similar situation, but already have a /20 allocation. I can 
use more public space, but due to our applications which need large 
blocks (/23 and /24) we end up with open space that we can not chop up 
and reallocate. For example our broadband Static IP Space or hosting 
space which are flat and not subnetted. Although we have returned /21 of 
space to our upstreames since our first allocation in 2003, we have been 
denied based on the 80% use of all IP space versus allocations based on 
routing and application.

FYI, we orginally applied for a /19 but were advised to return /21 of 
space and reaply which we did but we denied due to change in policies. 
So is life!

My understanding is that your client should be able qualify for their 
first Arin allocation. They should then work on moving upstream provided 
IP over to the Allocation so that they can return upstream space. I 
haven't seen a rule on this, but its is wise to do so in case you lose 
or want to change upstream providers. Many of us change upstream 
providers to get better deals or move into an Exchange Point (IX) 
peering arrangement.

Has your customer looked at the end user allocation process. Here is a link

https://www.arin.net/resources/request/ipv4_initial_assign.html

I did try this in order to open a new datacenter with a /23, and could 
not get that based on utilization of the current /20. It seems the 
process doesn't care about the need. So to get us going, I requested a 
/23 from a new upstream provider to get our business. Later on after we 
are operational, we will migrate some of our /20 allocation, but its not 
going to be easy on current customers that will have to be assigned new 
IP addresses. (DNS Changes, VPN Changes, Security (Access Control) 
changes. One customer has 80 remote offices!

But it seems to me that there has to be a way for smaller providers with 
no allocations to obtain blocks and then retun upstream blocks as part 
of the process.

Seems that if not, smaller providers starting up or in our case focused 
on conservation should go away while the large telcos and broadband 
provides either "suck the pool dry" or rest on large allocations they 
got years ago.

So something sounds strange since need upstream blocks to get into the 
business. The Arin contact seems to be saying no one gets their first 
allocation based on your customer's scenario as I read it which is to 
get the first allocation. Maybe they do not qualify for /19 but could 
for /20 or /21.

FYI, we have been working on IPv6. The new data center will be native IPv6.

Good Luck,


Jake

-- 
Jacob Epstein, Chief Technology Officer
RECOL, LLC - An Internet Solutions Provider
web: http://www.recol.net
email: jake at recol.com



Randy Carpenter wrote:
> I am working with a new customer who is in a bit of a pickle...
>
> They are an ISP and VoIP provider whose upstream provider wouldn't (or couldn't) give them many addresses.
> They resorted to using NATed private IPs for most of their network, which is causing problems for their end user customers.
>
> Now that we are working with them, I am trying to find a solution to get them public IPs. They are also soon to be multi-homed (They have 2 connections, but no BGP yet). As an ISP, it would be best for them to have PI space.
>
> The issue is that one of the requirements for getting PI space from ARIN is that you are already using Public space that was assigned to you from an upstream provider. I spoke with someone from ARIN who says there is no way around this. The need around a /19 of space, and I cannot find any way to get it for them. The upstream providers refuse to give them any.
>
> What can be done about this?  Would would there be a requirement of already using someone else's IP space to get your own? That seems like a complete waste of time, effort, money, and IPs!
>
> -Randy
>
> --
> | Randy Carpenter
> | V.P., IT Services
> | First Network Group, Inc.
> | RHCE
> | (419)739-9240, x1
> --
>
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