[arin-discuss] use of not clear

Michael Hasse mhasse at itwerx.net
Wed Sep 23 01:45:03 EDT 2009

Or simply a usage audit of legacy /8s owned by such as duPont, Eli  
Lily, Ford, Merck et al.  There's more than a few /8s out there that  
are likely pretty sparsely implemented.  Not to mention ones that have  
been rolled into other orgs, e.g. ranges originally assigned to DEC,  
CSC and others.  (How many /8s does a non-ISP need anyway?  Hope I'm  
not speaking out of turn here...)


Michael Hasse

If our service is not 100% satisfactory please tell us!
If it is 100% please tell others!

On Sep 22, 2009, at 8:05 PM, David Farmer wrote:

Owen DeLong wrote:
> I think that now is NOT the time to be expanding the wasted IPv4
> address space.  This block should be documented for it's prior
> misuse in examples.  That use should be deprecated, and, the block
> should be placed in the free pool.
> I would not object to placing it low on the priority list of blocks  
> to be
> issued, but, that's 65,536 IPs that should not be left fallow simply
> due to prior misuse.
> Owen

I'm not sure I would classify it as misuse.  If IANA assigned it for  
that purpose that is its use.  So, my initial reaction is let it be,  
we don't need it that bad.

But, lets do a little spelunking in historical RFCs.  Because that is  
a really old chunk of IP address space, I should know my organization  
has Which we got even a couple years after the one in  
question was assigned;

First documented in RFC 923 - "ASSIGNED NUMBERS", IANA originally  
assigned - to Net Dynamics Exp, the contact  
listed was Zaw-Sing Su, SRI, ZSu at SRI-TSC.ARPA (Now thats an old email  
address :)).

I assume that is Network Dynamics Experiment and in the modern CIDR  
world that would be

A little more spelunking I find this excerpt from RFC 898 - "GATEWAY  
SPECIAL INTEREST GROUP MEETING NOTES" that looks like it might be  

   SAC Gateway -- SRI - Su/Lewis

      Postel:  This was a presentation of the design for the gateways to
      be used in the advanced SAC demo experiments on network
      partitioning and reconstitution, and communication between
      intermingiling mobile networks.  Much of these demonstrations will
      be done with packet radio units and networks.  Some of the ideas
      are to use a gateway-centered type of addressing and double
      encapsulation (i.e., an extra IP header) to route datagrams.


      Network dynamics due to component mobility or failure.
      Mobile host, reconstitution, partitioning.
        H/W:  11/23
        S/W:  Some "C" gateway
        OS:   VMOS (SRI)

      Gateway-centered addressing, rather than network.
        Gw host instead of net.host.
      Double encapsulation:  additional IP header.
        TCP uses addr as an ID, IP uses it as an ADDRESS (-> route)
        Need to separate these dual uses of this address field.
      Incremental Routing (next-hop indication)

I'm not sure that these are the same thing, but they both sound like  
cool projects.  If anyone can provide some pointers I'd personally be  
interested in more details.  But, enough spelunking in dank dark old  
RFCs, lets jump a little further forward.

Looking at RIPE's Early Registration Transfer Project information, by  
the way trying ARIN's I get a 404 page.


ARIN was transfered and, all the rest of I assume stayed with IANA.

The only thing I can find in whois now;

OrgName:    Interop Show Network
OrgID:      ISN-4
Address:    600 Harrison St
City:       San Francisco
StateProv:  CA
PostalCode: 94107
Country:    US

NetRange: -
NetName:    SHOWNETB3
NetHandle:  NET-128-64-0-0-1
Parent:     NET-128-0-0-0-0
NetType:    Direct Assignment
RegDate:    1991-09-18
Updated:    2003-03-06

Maybe we can get this returned too?

So we are talking about maybe re-aggregating a whole /12 if and were returned to IANA and put in the  
free pool.  A /12 is going to become a very globally significant chunk  
of IP space very soon now.

So I take back my initial reaction and believe that Owen is right,  
document that is no longer considered a test network,  
raise the word far and wide don't filter  Then recover it.

Further, should Interop be asked to return

It should be done very politely, with the utmost diplomacy, if it is  
asked at all.  But, should it be asked? If, so Who? and, How?

I've probably added more that a couple cents worth, but Scott did ask  
for a little history.  This is by no means authoritative, I wasn't  
there, some that actually knows details please speak up.


> On Sep 22, 2009, at 7:46 AM, Jason Schiller wrote:
>> On behalf of Ron Bonica,
>> Folks,
>> The IETF has recently passed draft-iana-rfc3330bis-08. This draft
>> documents the fact that the following address ranges have been  
>> reserved
>> for documentation:
>> - (TEST-NET-1)
>> - (TEST-NET-2)
>> - (TEST-NET-3)
>> In addition, some authors have used (TEST-B) for  
>> example
>> purposes. There is no RFC that talks about this block, but my
>> understanding is that IANA/ARIN have marked it as reserved. If you
>> search the Internet you will find at least some number of examples  
>> and
>> firewall rule sets that use this block, but I have no good idea about
>> how widespread such usage is.
>> What should we do about this block? Some of the potential answers
>> include documenting its role, marking it as reserved but  
>> deprecating its
>> use in examples, and returning it to the free pool immediately  
>> (with a
>> warning sign about possible filtering problems).
>> Comments?
>>                                     Ron

David Farmer               Email:farmer at umn.edu
Networking & Telecommunication Services
Office of Information Technology
University of Minnesota	
2218 University Ave SE	    Phone: 612-626-0815
Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029   Cell: 612-812-9952
You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
the ARIN Discussion Mailing List (ARIN-discuss at arin.net).
Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
Please contact info at arin.net if you experience any issues.

More information about the ARIN-discuss mailing list