<div dir="ltr">No, this draft policy is not merely a clarification. This would a significant change in policy, and if enforced would significantly interfere with the efficient operation of the Internet.<div><br></div><div>ARIN should only care whether addresses are in use on an operational network. They have no reason to care about the connectivity, or lack thereof, between an LIR and operational networks that it reallocates or reassigns space to.</div><div><br></div><div>I run an operational network. We still use a number of address blocks originally allocated to us by our transit providers before we acquired our own space, which we have always announced in BGP in a multihomed fashion. If we stop announcing the route to the transit provider who announced us the space, whether temporarily (due to an outage or maintenance) or more permanently (because we no longer need transit from them there), we should be able to continue using our assigned space as long as we have appropriate contractual arrangements in place to do so. That is a form of "leasing" that has always been allowed, and this policy would disallow it.</div><div><br></div><div>Any policy requiring a certain form of connectivity between an LIR and its customers will either be unenforceable and easily gamed, or onerous, bureaucratic, and will interfere with the legitimate operation of networks efficiently utilizing their IPv4 space.</div><div><br></div><div>-Scott</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Aug 24, 2022 at 9:32 AM Fernando Frediani <<a href="mailto:fhfrediani@gmail.com">fhfrediani@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<p>Hello Scott</p>
<p>Could you explain better the arguments you are against in this
proposal or that don't sound valid?</p>
<p>All this proposal does is to make clear make something clear in
the policy text.<br>
If you cannot go to ARIN and justify that you intend to use
requested IP addresses for simple leasing proposes, to be leased
to organization with who you don't provide any connectivity
services, why would it be an accepted thing in any other scenario
?<br>
IP space is to be used for building Internet infrastructure and to
get customers connected to the Internet, not to be simply leased
from one organization pretending to be a RIR to another.</p>
<p>Unless I misunderstood and you like the idea of leasing and so
why you oppose this proposal.</p>
<p>Regards<br>
Fernando<br>
</p>
<div>On 24/08/2022 12:40, Scott Leibrand
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
Opposed. There is no good reason I am aware of for ARIN to require
the bundling of IP addressing and connectivity services. The
arguments provided in this draft policy are not sound or valid
ones. <br>
<br>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>Scott</div>
</div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
<blockquote type="cite">On Aug 23, 2022, at 9:28 AM, ARIN
<a href="mailto:info@arin.net" target="_blank"><info@arin.net></a> wrote:<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 18 August 2022, the ARIN Advisory
Council (AC) accepted "ARIN-prop-308: Leasing Not
Intended" as a Draft Policy.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Draft Policy ARIN-2022-9 is below and
can be found at:</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://www.arin.net/participate/policy/drafts/2022_9/" target="_blank">https://www.arin.net/participate/policy/drafts/2022_9/</a></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">You are encouraged to discuss all Draft
Policies on PPML. The AC will evaluate the discussion to
assess the conformance of this draft policy with ARIN's
Principles of Internet number resource policy as stated in
the Policy Development Process (PDP). Specifically, these
principles are:</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">* Enabling Fair and Impartial Number
Resource Administration</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">* Technically Sound</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">* Supported by the Community</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">The PDP can be found at:</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://www.arin.net/participate/policy/pdp/" target="_blank">https://www.arin.net/participate/policy/pdp/</a></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Draft Policies and Proposals under
discussion can be found at: <a href="https://www.arin.net/participate/policy/drafts/" target="_blank">https://www.arin.net/participate/policy/drafts/</a></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Regards,</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Sean Hopkins</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Senior Policy Analyst</p>
<p class="MsoNormal">American Registry for Internet Numbers
(ARIN)</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Draft Policy ARIN-2022-9: Leasing Not
Intended</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Problem Statement:</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">“IPv6 Policy (section 6.4.1.)
explicitly mention that address space is not a property.
This is also stated in the RSA (section 7.) for all the
Internet Number Resources.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">However, with the spirit of the IPv4
allocation policies being the same, there is not an
equivalent text for IPv4, neither for ASNs.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Further to that, policies for IPv4 and
IPv6 allocations, clearly state that allocations are based
on justified need and not solely on a predicted customer
base. Similar text can be found in the section related to
Transfers (8.1).</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Consequently, resources not only aren’t
a property, but also, aren’t allocated for leasing
purposes, only for justified need of the resource holder
and its directly connected customers.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Therefore, and so that there are no
doubts about it, it should be made explicit in the NRPM
that the Internet Resources should not be leased “per se”,
but only as part of a direct connectivity service. At the
same time, section 6.4.1. should be moved to the top of
the NRPM (possibly to section 1. “Principles and Goals of
the American Registry for Internet Numbers (ARIN)”.”</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Policy statement:</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Actual Text (to be replaced by New
Text):</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">6.4.1. Address Space Not to be
Considered Property</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">It is contrary to the goals of this
document and is not in the interests of the Internet
community as a whole for address space to be considered
freehold property.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">The policies in this document are based
upon the understanding that globally-unique IPv6 unicast
address space is allocated/assigned for use rather than
owned.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">New Text</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">1.5. Internet Number Resources Not to
be Considered Property</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">It is contrary to the goals of this
document and is not in the interests of the Internet
community as a whole for address space to be considered
freehold property.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">The policies in this document are based
upon the understanding that Internet Number Resources are
allocated/assigned for use rather than owned.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">ARIN allocate and assign Internet
resources in a delegation scheme, with an annual validity,
renewable as long as the requirements specified by the
policies in force at the time of renewal are met, and
especially the justification of the need.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Therefore, the resources can’t be
considered property.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">The justification of the need,
generically in the case of addresses, implies their need
to directly connect customers. Therefore, the leasing of
addresses is not considered acceptable, nor does it
justify the need, if they are not part of a set of
services based, at least, on direct connectivity.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Even in cases of networks not connected
to the Internet, the leasing of addresses is not
admissible, since said sites can request direct
assignments from ARIN and even in the case of IPv4, use
private addresses or arrange transfers.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Timetable for implementation: Immediate
</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Situation in other Regions:</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">In other RIRs, the leasing of addresses
is not authorized either and since it is not explicit in
their policy manuals either, this proposal will be
presented as well.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Nothing is currently mentioned in RIPE
about this and it is not acceptable as a justification of
the need. In AFRINIC, APNIC and LACNIC, the staff has
confirmed that address leasing is not considered as valid
for the justification.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
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