got it.<br><br>On Thursday, August 4, 2022, Paul E McNary via ARIN-PPML <<a href="mailto:arin-ppml@arin.net">arin-ppml@arin.net</a>> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">If I understood what John clarified for me earlier in this thread ...<br>
Many of the Legacy blocks will not be under NPRM and ARIN has to tread very carefully on trying to claw these addresses back.<br>
Many blocks that might be abandoned fall into legacy, especially /24's, assigned pre-ARIN.<br>
As always, many times I understand incorrectly.<br>
<br>
----- Original Message -----<br>
From: "Ted Mittelstaedt" <<a href="mailto:tedm@ipinc.net">tedm@ipinc.net</a>><br>
To: "John Curran" <<a href="mailto:jcurran@arin.net">jcurran@arin.net</a>><br>
Cc: "arin-ppml" <<a href="mailto:arin-ppml@arin.net">arin-ppml@arin.net</a>><br>
Sent: Thursday, August 4, 2022 9:30:36 PM<br>
Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] ARIN actions regarding address blocks with no valid POCs (was: Re: Deceased Companies?)<br>
<br>
> Ted -<br>
> <br>
> To my knowledge, the Number Resource Policy Manual (NRPM, i.e. <br>
> <a href="https://www.arin.net/participate/policy/nrpm/" target="_blank">https://www.arin.net/<wbr>participate/policy/nrpm/</a> <br>
> <<a href="https://www.arin.net/participate/policy/nrpm/" target="_blank">https://www.arin.net/<wbr>participate/policy/nrpm/</a>> ) does not presently <br>
> provide for ARIN performing reclamation of address blocks assigned to an <br>
> organization that has no valid POCs – it provides that such <br>
> organizations "will be unable to access further functionalities within <br>
> ARIN Online” and cannot be receiving organization for a reallocation or <br>
> detailed reassignment. (NRPM 3.6.5 and NRPM 3.7 respectively)<br>
><br>
<br>
Technically an org like LT is obtaining a detailed reassignment from<br>
whatever ISP they are using (most likely, it's a /29) Of course, they<br>
probably don't even realize or remember that they have a prior <br>
allocation which according to the NRPM needs valid POCs and also needs <br>
to meet utilization requirements before they were supposed to get their /29<br>
<br>
But, like I said, they aren't bad people, just likely ignorant of what<br>
they have. I suspect ARIN could take care of this by directly <br>
contacting them based on 3.6.5 and 3.7. I also suspect that is the case <br>
for a lot of the abandoned stuff. I do agree it would take a LOT of <br>
manpower and lacking clear direction from the community to do it is<br>
probably a big sticking point for ARIN which is why you are hinting a<br>
policy change is needed.<br>
<br>
> If you’d like ARIN to take particular action on address blocks with no <br>
> valid POCs, please propose policy specifying the actions for community <br>
> consideration and potential adoption.<br>
As you know, the main reason the POC validation was put into NRPM was to <br>
allow ARIN to require POC validity, so that it would discourage spammers <br>
and other criminals from trying to hide themselves behind fake names if<br>
they registered blocks, and it would make it possible to alert block<br>
holders who had bad citizens acting from IPs in their blocks.<br>
<br>
It was the "license plate" argument, that is, just like a car they are<br>
using a public resource, so the public has a right to know who they are,<br>
which is why we slap license plates on cars. Even though that really<br>
pisses off some people.<br>
<br>
But a secondary reason was to try to get a handle (no pun intended) on<br>
the extent of the "abandoned resources" problem. Along with validation <br>
came a requirement for ARIN to report. Well, it's certainly been long<br>
enough to get some valid data back - could you, John, say now, based on<br>
that data, what percentage of IPv4 number resources in ARIN are like <br>
this particular one - they have only invalid POCs and no valid ones?<br>
<br>
While those resources might not be available for use (as their orgs <br>
might be using them internally and just not kept up with the reporting <br>
requirements) if you could give us a percentage, if it's high enough<br>
it might stimulate the community to support additional requirements for<br>
having ARIN get a bit more activist on getting these resources back.<br>
<br>
I sort of liken this to the "abandoned car" issue in a major city. If<br>
the numbers of abandoned vehicles in a city are below .0001% then the<br>
population does nothing, but if it increases to .01% or .1% the <br>
population goes ballistic and starts demanding the city start towing,<br>
because the public wants it's street parking space back.<br>
<br>
So the question is, what are we leaving on the table? I think that was<br>
the thrust behind the very first query on this thread.<br>
<br>
Frankly I DO think we should seriously consider revoking registrations <br>
of number blocks that lack valid POCs. In this day and age, asking a <br>
number block holder to supply a valid POC is the absolute LEAST that the <br>
community can ask. It's not enough to have just a valid street address. <br>
It is after all, year 2022. Having an email address is NOT a barrier <br>
to anyone. If they are a small org they can just duplicate most of the <br>
info in the main number block into a POC and add a phone number and <br>
email address. It's not a hardship. If they are large then a street<br>
address of some main corporate HQ is useless if anyone needs to contact<br>
an individual about something going on from their IP addresses.<br>
<br>
Ted<br>
<br>
> You can find more information on <br>
> submission of policy proposals here - <br>
> <a href="https://www.arin.net/participate/policy/pdp/appendix_b/" target="_blank">https://www.arin.net/<wbr>participate/policy/pdp/<wbr>appendix_b/</a> <br>
> <<a href="https://www.arin.net/participate/policy/pdp/appendix_b/" target="_blank">https://www.arin.net/<wbr>participate/policy/pdp/<wbr>appendix_b/</a>><br>
> <br>
> Thanks!<br>
> /John<br>
> <br>
> John Curran<br>
> President and CEO<br>
> American Registry for Internet Numbers<br>
> <br>
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