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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Jordi,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">I do not support the petition as I view the problem statement as invalid. The proposal co-mingles contractual obligations, implementation and requirements outside of the purview of ARIN.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">The NRPM does not trump the Registration Services Agreement which this proposal attempts to override.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">The initiatives that are going on in the operator community, through RPKI and IRR filtering has made an impact and should be the primary avenue for addressing this issue.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">If there are avenues that could be used within policy, I do not see it in the proposal.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Kevin</span><span lang="EN-US" style="color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> ARIN-PPML <arin-ppml-bounces@arin.net>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via ARIN-PPML<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, April 29, 2019 3:50 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Paul Andersen <paul@arin.net>; ARIN-PPML List <arin-ppml@arin.net><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [arin-ppml] Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="ES-TRAD" style="font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Hi Paul,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="ES-TRAD" style="font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">I understand that, but I’m not convinced that will be useful because then folks regardless in favor or against the policy text, may not yet respond to the petition as
we get engaged in discussing what is good or bad in the text and how sort it out. I’ve seen that already in several messages that support/oppose to the proposal when in fact the question is a different one (the petition and not actually responding to that).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">My view is that people that will like to get answers and participate in the process should first support the petition.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">It is clear that in general in any RIR, it should be possible to speak about ideas on policies, but in this case is not anymore “just an idea”, so the right way to support
it, is to seek the adoption as a draft policy.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Of course, I may be wrong, but this is my perception right now.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.5pt;color:black"><br>
Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.5pt;color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Jordi<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.5pt;color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">El 29/4/19 21:03, "ARIN-PPML en nombre de Paul Andersen" <<a href="mailto:arin-ppml-bounces@arin.net">arin-ppml-bounces@arin.net</a> en nombre de
<a href="mailto:paul@arin.net">paul@arin.net</a>> escribió:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">Jordi,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">A small point on your post below. I read your comment below that you feel that discussion of your policy idea is not possible until accepted. This is not in fact the case as it relates to PPML.
As you can see from the mailing list description (posted below) there is no need for a policy idea to have a formal number to be discussed. As long as posts fall within the mailing list AUP free discussion is encouraged. Historically we even saw many policy
ideas get early feedback on PPML prior to them becoming formal policies. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">So I think continued feedback on your proposal should be encouraged. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">Cheers,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">Paul<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">—<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">Paul Andersen<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">Chair, ARIN Board of Trustees<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">>>>>> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">Open to the general public. Provides a forum to raise and discuss policy-related ideas and issues surrounding existing and proposed ARIN policies. The PPML list is an intrinsic part of ARIN’s Policy Development
Process, which details how proposed policies are handled.<br>
<br>
Discussion on PPML can cover a variety of policy related topics, and ARIN encourages free discussion. ARIN announcements to the PPML about policy proposals or draft policies include the proposal number or draft policy number in the subject field. Please retain
the policy number in the subject line when you make comments about specific proposals or draft policies. Your post or reply should open with a statement of support or nonsupport for the topic to allow others to follow discussions of interest more easily and
make your position clear.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><<<<<<o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">On Apr 29, 2019, at 2:28 PM, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via ARIN-PPML <<a href="mailto:arin-ppml@arin.net">arin-ppml@arin.net</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">Right, I was about to respond as well, but I think at this stage we should keep the discussion on the petition.</span><span lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt">All those details could be agreed once we have the proposal adopted for the discussion. In fact, we have a new version ready (v2, being published in RIPE soon) with
have a lot of additional details on that, which is part of the outcome of several weeks of discussion on our RIPE v1 of this proposal.</span><span lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.5pt"><br>
Regards,</span><span lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.5pt">Jordi</span><span lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:35.4pt">
<span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.5pt"> </span><span lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12.0pt"> </span><span lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">El 29/4/19 20:17, "ARIN-PPML en nombre de William Herrin" <<a href="mailto:arin-ppml-bounces@arin.net"><span style="color:purple">arin-ppml-bounces@arin.net</span></a><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>en
nombre de<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:bill@herrin.us"><span style="color:purple">bill@herrin.us</span></a>> escribió:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 9:53 AM Mike Arbrouet <<a href="mailto:mike@brainiacsquad.com"><span style="color:purple">mike@brainiacsquad.com</span></a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">> Can anyone (policy expert) help me out with some ambiguities<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">> regarding the selection procedures of the Expert's Pool? These<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">> clarifications are important for me to be able to make a decision on<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">> supporting/rejecting the [arin-ppml] Open Petition for <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">> ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation.<br>
<br>
Hi Mike,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">Respectfully, we're at a different part of the conversation here. The only decision you're asked to make about the petition is whether we should be discussing the proposal at all. The formulation
of the experts pool (or whether the proposal retains a shape that needs an experts pool) is a discussion for later (or never) depending on your choice on the petition.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">As you decide whether to support the petition, the petition to discuss and work on the proposal, consider: you dived in to and discussed the proposal's details.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">Bill Herrin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:70.8pt">
<span lang="ES"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">--<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">William Herrin ................<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:herrin@dirtside.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">herrin@dirtside.com</span></a><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span> <a href="mailto:bill@herrin.us" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">bill@herrin.us</span></a><br>
Dirtside Systems ......... Web: <<a href="http://www.dirtside.com/" target="_blank"><span style="color:purple">http://www.dirtside.com/</span></a>><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<div style="margin-left:35.4pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES">_______________________________________________ ARIN-PPML You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (<a href="mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net"><span style="color:purple">ARIN-PPML@arin.net</span></a>).
Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml"><span style="color:purple">https://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml</span></a><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Please
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:35.4pt"><span lang="ES" style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif"><br>
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