<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Jan 9, 2015, at 10:33 , Karl Brumund <<a href="mailto:kbrumund@dyn.com" class="">kbrumund@dyn.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Jan 8, 2015, at 5:40 PM, Heather Schiller <<a href="mailto:heather.skanks@gmail.com" class="">heather.skanks@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class="">Happy New Year PPML!</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""> As one of the shepherds of this policy, it would be very helpful to hear from the community on this proposal. Comments for or against are welcome, as are any questions.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div></div></div></blockquote><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Reading 2008-5, it appears that the authors at the time expected that ISPs may relax their filter rules to allow longer than /24 routes. Given that doing so would encourage a lot more deaggregation of existing /24s, I find it unlikely that ISPs will permit longer than /24 in any appreciable number to matter.</div><div class="">Thus it seems that having a minimum of /28 for direct allocations is impractical, and that these would happen through assignments, as today.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div>As one of the authors of 2008-5, yes, you are (mostly) correct.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>I didn’t expect ISPs to relax their filters in general, but I did expect ISPs might relax their filters for this particular designated block. I don’t see any reason that wouldn’t be possible even now as that would not encourage (or even allow) deaggregation of existing /24s.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>We are talking about a relatively small block being preserved to provide minimal resources for (primarily) post-runout new entrants (or at least that was my intent at the time of writing).</div><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><div class="">I see nothing wrong with 2014-22, but am open to hearing other comments.</div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div>I see no advantage to 2014-22. I think when this block comes into play, since it is a particular designated block, ISPs will react relatively quickly to allow longer prefixes within this space when it becomes necessary.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Since it is only a single /10, even at /28, we’re talking about a maximum of 16,384 additional prefixes.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Owen</div><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">…karl</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class="">You may want to read this report from RIPE Labs, specifically discussing the existing policy, and tests they did on routability of small prefixes. </div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><a href="https://labs.ripe.net/Members/emileaben/propagation-of-longer-than-24-ipv4-prefixes" class="">https://labs.ripe.net/Members/emileaben/propagation-of-longer-than-24-ipv4-prefixes</a><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Thanks!</div><div class="">--Heather</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote">---------- Forwarded message ----------<br class="">From:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="gmail_sendername">ARIN</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span dir="ltr" class=""><<a href="mailto:info@arin.net" target="_blank" class="">info@arin.net</a>></span><br class="">Date: Tue, Nov 25, 2014 at 3:35 PM<br class="">Subject: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2014-22: Removal of Minimum in Section 4.10<br class="">To:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:arin-ppml@arin.net" target="_blank" class="">arin-ppml@arin.net</a><br class=""><br class=""><br class="">On 20 November 2014 the ARIN Advisory Council (AC) accepted "ARIN-prop-214 Removal of Minimum in Section 4.10" as a Draft Policy.<br class=""><br class="">Draft Policy ARIN-2014-22 is below and can be found at:<br class=""><a href="https://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/2014_22.html" target="_blank" class="">https://www.arin.net/policy/<u class=""></u>proposals/2014_22.html</a><br class=""><br class="">You are encouraged to discuss the merits and your concerns of Draft<br class="">Policy 2014-22 on the Public Policy Mailing List.<br class=""><br class="">The AC will evaluate the discussion in order to assess the conformance<br class="">of this draft policy with ARIN's Principles of Internet Number Resource<br class="">Policy as stated in the PDP. Specifically, these principles are:<br class=""><br class=""> * Enabling Fair and Impartial Number Resource Administration<br class=""> * Technically Sound<br class=""> * Supported by the Community<br class=""><br class="">The ARIN Policy Development Process (PDP) can be found at:<br class=""><a href="https://www.arin.net/policy/pdp.html" target="_blank" class="">https://www.arin.net/policy/<u class=""></u>pdp.html</a><br class=""><br class="">Draft Policies and Proposals under discussion can be found at:<br class=""><a href="https://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/index.html" target="_blank" class="">https://www.arin.net/policy/<u class=""></u>proposals/index.html</a><br class=""><br class="">Regards,<br class=""><br class="">Communications and Member Services<br class="">American Registry for Internet Numbers (ARIN)<br class=""><br class=""><br class="">## * ##<br class=""><br class=""><br class="">Draft Policy ARIN-2014-22<br class="">Removal of Minimum in Section 4.10<br class=""><br class="">Date: 25 November 2014<br class=""><br class="">Problem Statement:<br class=""><br class="">The current section 4.10 Dedicated IPv4 block to facilitate IPv6 Deployment creates an issue where a small new organization that requires an IPv4 allocation or assignment would potentially receive a block that today would be unroutable and therefore unusable for it intended purposes.<br class=""><br class="">Policy statement:<br class=""><br class="">Change<br class=""><br class="">"This block will be subject to a minimum size allocation of /28 and a maximum size allocation of /24. ARIN should use sparse allocation when possible within that /10 block."<br class=""><br class="">To<br class=""><br class="">"This block will be subject to an allocation of /24. ARIN should use sparse allocation when possible within that /10 block."<br class=""><br class="">Timetable for implementation: Immediate<br class="">______________________________<u class=""></u>_________________<br class="">PPML<br class="">You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to<br class="">the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (<a href="mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net" target="_blank" class="">ARIN-PPML@arin.net</a>).<br class="">Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:<br class=""><a href="http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml" target="_blank" class="">http://lists.arin.net/mailman/<u class=""></u>listinfo/arin-ppml</a><br class="">Please contact<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:info@arin.net" target="_blank" class="">info@arin.net</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>if you experience any issues.<br class=""></div><br class=""></div>_______________________________________________<br class="">PPML<br class="">You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to<br class="">the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (<a href="mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net" class="">ARIN-PPML@arin.net</a>).<br class="">Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:<br class=""><a href="http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml" class="">http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml</a><br class="">Please contact <a href="mailto:info@arin.net" class="">info@arin.net</a> if you experience any issues.</div></blockquote></div><br class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; 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