<div dir="ltr">Jeffrey,<div><br></div><div>The text was changed from "<span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.800000190734863px">Upon</span><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.800000190734863px"> </span><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.800000190734863px">verification</span><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.800000190734863px"> that the organization has already obtained </span><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.800000190734863px">connectivity at its new discrete network site" because folks felt that this meant the connection had to be up and running, not just under contract. I believe there is more justification required than just "having a new site". I see nothing in the current policy that states an automatic /24. Here is the policy text as it stands today from NRPM (see below)</span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.800000190734863px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.800000190734863px">Thanks!</span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.800000190734863px">----Cathy</span></div>
<div><font face="arial, sans-serif"><span style="font-size:12.666666984558105px"><br></span></font></div><div><h4 style="margin:1em 0px 0.5em;padding:0px;border:0px;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;line-height:16px;font-size:12px!important">
4.5. Multiple Discrete Networks</h4><p style="margin:0.5em 0px;padding:0px;border:0px;font-size:1.2em;line-height:1.5em;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Organizations with multiple discrete networks desiring to request new or additional address space under a single Organization ID must meet the following criteria:</p>
<ol style="margin:0.5em 0px;padding:0px 0px 0px 30px;border:0px;font-size:10.285714149475098px;list-style-position:initial;color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;line-height:16px"><li style="margin:0.25em 0px 0px;padding:0px;border:0px;background-color:transparent;line-height:1.5em;font-size:12px!important">
The organization shall be a single entity and not a consortium of smaller independent entities.</li><li style="margin:0.25em 0px 0px;padding:0px;border:0px;background-color:transparent;line-height:1.5em;font-size:12px!important">
The organization must have compelling criteria for creating discrete networks. Examples of a discrete network might include:<ol style="margin:0.25em;padding:0px 0px 0px 30px;border:0px;background-color:transparent;list-style-position:initial;line-height:1.5em">
<li style="margin:0.25em 0px 0px;padding:0px;border:0px;background-color:transparent;list-style-type:lower-alpha;line-height:1.5em">Regulatory restrictions for data transmission,</li><li style="margin:0.25em 0px 0px;padding:0px;border:0px;background-color:transparent;list-style-type:lower-alpha;line-height:1.5em">
Geographic distance and diversity between networks,</li><li style="margin:0.25em 0px 0px;padding:0px;border:0px;background-color:transparent;list-style-type:lower-alpha;line-height:1.5em">Autonomous multihomed discrete networks.</li>
</ol></li><li style="margin:0.25em 0px 0px;padding:0px;border:0px;background-color:transparent;line-height:1.5em;font-size:12px!important">The organization must keep detailed records on how it has allocated space to each location, including the date of each allocation.</li>
<li style="margin:0.25em 0px 0px;padding:0px;border:0px;background-color:transparent;line-height:1.5em;font-size:12px!important">When applying for additional internet address registrations from ARIN, the organization must demonstrate utilization greater than 50% of both the last block allocated and the aggregate sum of all blocks allocated from ARIN to that organization. If an organization is unable to satisfy this 50% minimum utilization criteria, the organization may alternatively qualify for additional internet address registrations by having all unallocated blocks of addresses smaller than ARIN's current minimum allocation size.</li>
<li style="margin:0.25em 0px 0px;padding:0px;border:0px;background-color:transparent;line-height:1.5em;font-size:12px!important">The organization may not allocate additional address space to a location until each of that location's address blocks are 80% utilized.</li>
<li style="margin:0.25em 0px 0px;padding:0px;border:0px;background-color:transparent;line-height:1.5em;font-size:12px!important">The organization should notify ARIN at the time of the request their desire to apply this policy to their account.</li>
</ol><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Mar 5, 2014 at 1:12 PM, Jeffrey Lyon <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jeffrey.lyon@blacklotus.net" target="_blank">jeffrey.lyon@blacklotus.net</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">I am opposed to the rewording as the new discrete site is in itself<br>
demonstration of need. There is a technical requirement to provide at<br>
least a /24 of space at any discrete site.<br>
<br>
Thanks, Jeff<br>
<div class=""><div class="h5"><br>
On Wed, Mar 5, 2014 at 6:16 PM, CJ Aronson <<a href="mailto:cja@daydream.com">cja@daydream.com</a>> wrote:<br>
> Does anyone else have comments about this proposal? The text has been<br>
> changed slightly based on feedback from the PPC at NANOG. The change was<br>
><br>
> from<br>
><br>
> Upon verification that the organization has already obtained<br>
> connectivity at its new discrete network site<br>
><br>
> to<br>
><br>
><br>
> Upon verification that the organization has demonstrated need at its new<br>
> discrete network site<br>
><br>
> Please send your comments on this change and on the proposal.<br>
><br>
> Thanks!<br>
> -----Cathy<br>
><br>
><br>
> On Wed, Mar 5, 2014 at 2:18 AM, Andrew Dul <<a href="mailto:andrew.dul@quark.net">andrew.dul@quark.net</a>> wrote:<br>
>><br>
>> I support this new version of the policy. I believe the new text<br>
>> successfully deals with the issues raised and discussed at the Atlanta<br>
>> nanog PPC.<br>
>><br>
>> Andrew<br>
>><br>
>> On 3/4/2014 12:13 PM, ARIN wrote:<br>
>> > ## * ##<br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > Recommended Draft Policy ARIN-2013-8<br>
>> > Subsequent Allocations for New Multiple Discrete Networks<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Date: 4 March 2014<br>
>> ><br>
>> > AC's assessment of conformance with the Principles of Internet Number<br>
>> > Resource Policy:<br>
>> ><br>
>> > "Subsequent Allocations for Additional Discrete Network Sites This<br>
>> > policy enables fair and impartial number resource administration by<br>
>> > documenting the current practice regarding allocations for additional<br>
>> > discrete network sites. The ARIN staff has been following a procedure<br>
>> > that has not been documented until now. By documenting this process<br>
>> > the community has clear understanding of how to get address space for<br>
>> > additional network sites.<br>
>> ><br>
>> > This is a technically sound proposal that has been in practice for<br>
>> > some time. It had just not been documented.<br>
>> ><br>
>> > This proposal has received several notes of support on the PPML and to<br>
>> > date has received no negative feedback."<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Policy Statement:<br>
>> ><br>
>> > IPv4:<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Add the following statement to section 4.5.4.<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Upon verification that the organization has demonstrated need at its new<br>
>> > discrete network site, the new networks shall be allocated the minimum<br>
>> > allocation size under section 4.2.1.5 unless the organization can<br>
>> > demonstrate additional need using the immediate need criteria (4.2.1.6).<br>
>> ><br>
>> > IPv6:<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Add an additional reference to section 6.11.5.b such that it<br>
>> > references both the initial allocation and subsequent allocation<br>
>> > sections of the IPv6 LIR policy.<br>
>> ><br>
>> > "Each network will be judged against the existing utilization criteria<br>
>> > specified in 6.5.2 and 6.5.3 as if it were a separate organization..."<br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > Comments:<br>
>> ><br>
>> > a. Timetable for implementation: immediate<br>
>> ><br>
>> > b. This policy is being proposed based upon the Policy Implementation<br>
>> > & Experience Report from ARIN 32.<br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > <a href="https://www.arin.net/participate/meetings/reports/ARIN_32/PDF/thursday/nobile-policy.pdf" target="_blank">https://www.arin.net/participate/meetings/reports/ARIN_32/PDF/thursday/nobile-policy.pdf</a><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > c: Older versions of the MDN policy did contain new network criteria.<br>
>> > This criteria appears to have been dropped during subsequent rewrites<br>
>> > of the MDN policy. "The organization must not allocate a CIDR block<br>
>> > larger than the current minimum assignment size of the RIR (currently<br>
>> > /20 for ARIN) to a new network."<br>
>> > (<a href="https://www.arin.net/policy/archive/nrpm_20041015.pdf" target="_blank">https://www.arin.net/policy/archive/nrpm_20041015.pdf</a>)<br>
>> > _______________________________________________<br>
>> > PPML<br>
>> > You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to<br>
>> > the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (<a href="mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net">ARIN-PPML@arin.net</a>).<br>
>> > Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:<br>
>> > <a href="http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml" target="_blank">http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml</a><br>
>> > Please contact <a href="mailto:info@arin.net">info@arin.net</a> if you experience any issues.<br>
>><br>
>> _______________________________________________<br>
>> PPML<br>
>> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to<br>
>> the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (<a href="mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net">ARIN-PPML@arin.net</a>).<br>
>> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:<br>
>> <a href="http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml" target="_blank">http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml</a><br>
>> Please contact <a href="mailto:info@arin.net">info@arin.net</a> if you experience any issues.<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
> PPML<br>
> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to<br>
> the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (<a href="mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net">ARIN-PPML@arin.net</a>).<br>
> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:<br>
> <a href="http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml" target="_blank">http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml</a><br>
> Please contact <a href="mailto:info@arin.net">info@arin.net</a> if you experience any issues.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</div></div><span class=""><font color="#888888">--<br>
Jeffrey A. Lyon, CISSP-ISSMP<br>
Fellow, Black Lotus Communications<br>
mobile: <a href="tel:%28757%29%20304-0668" value="+17573040668">(757) 304-0668</a> | gtalk: <a href="mailto:jeffrey.lyon@gmail.com">jeffrey.lyon@gmail.com</a> | skype: <a href="http://blacklotus.net" target="_blank">blacklotus.net</a><br>
</font></span></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div>