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    Which leads me to think the era of the regional RIR is over. Time to
    move back to a single registry.<br>
    <br>
    -lee<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 10/8/2013 2:40 PM, Steven Ryerse
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:5B9E90747FA2974D91A54FCFA1B8AD12013CE81735@ENI-MAIL.eclipse-networks.com"
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        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">The
            virtual train has left the station.  80% of the servers we
            are doing now are Virtual and most need Internet IP
            addresses.  Almost all of the Internet IP addresses I’m
            assigning today are being assigned to virtual servers. 
            Treating them somehow like they are different than say a
            router in that they need one or more IP addresses makes no
            sense.  An Internet IP address - is an Internet IP address -
            is an Internet IP address - no matter what it is assigned
            to.  <o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I
            don’t like adding needless restrictions.  -1<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><i><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet
              MS","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Steven
              Ryerse<o:p></o:p></span></i></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><i><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet
              MS","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">President<o:p></o:p></span></i></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><i><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet
              MS","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">100 Ashford
              Center North, Suite 110, Atlanta, GA  30338<o:p></o:p></span></i></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><i><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet
              MS","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">770.656.1460
              - Cell<o:p></o:p></span></i></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><i><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet
              MS","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">770.399.9099-
              Office<o:p></o:p></span></i></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"MS
            Mincho";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><img
              id="Picture_x0020_1"
              src="cid:part1.01090200.01010206@dilkie.com"
              alt="Description: Description: Eclipse Networks
              Logo_small.png" height="37" width="56"></span><span
            style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"MS
            Mincho";color:#1F497D">℠</span><span
            style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet
            MS","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">
          </span><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet
            MS","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Eclipse
            Networks, Inc.</span><span
            style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet
            MS","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="text-indent:.5in"><sup><span
              style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet
              MS","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">       
              Conquering Complex Networks</span></sup><sup><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">℠</span></sup><sup><span
              style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet
              MS","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></sup></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">
            Scott Leibrand [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:scottleibrand@gmail.com">mailto:scottleibrand@gmail.com</a>]
            <br>
            <b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, October 08, 2013 1:45 PM<br>
            <b>To:</b> Steven Ryerse<br>
            <b>Cc:</b> John Curran; Frank Bulk;
            <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:arin-ppml@arin.net"><arin-ppml@arin.net></a><br>
            <b>Subject:</b> Re: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2013-6:
            Allocation of IPv4 and IPv6 Address Space to Out-of-region
            Requestors - Revised<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Steven,<o:p></o:p></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">Were you following the discussion at
              the NANOG PPC?  (It's being webcast.)<o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">The challenge with what you're
              describing seems to be that many organizations who provide
              virtual servers, tunnels, or other similar services over
              virtual infrastructure have to justify their addresses
              based on how many customers they have (as their physical
              infrastructure isn't necessarily growing).<o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">There will also be another round of
              discussion of this policy at the ARIN Public Policy
              meeting later this week.<o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">-Scott<o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
        </div>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Oct 8, 2013 at 10:35 AM, Steven
              Ryerse <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                href="mailto:SRyerse@eclipse-networks.com"
                target="_blank">SRyerse@eclipse-networks.com</a>>
              wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
            <p class="MsoNormal">I keep seeing questions going back and
              forth on this issue.  As I understand it two things are
              trying to be accomplished, first ARIN issued resources are
              to be primarily used on equipment located within the ARIN
              region, and second there needs to be some sort of legal
              presence with contact information in the ARIN region that
              can be kept in the ARIN database for everyone including
              law enforcement to access.  Can't the policy simply say
              there must be a legal presence and the resources must be
              used within the ARIN region, and that resources can be
              de-allocated if either ceases to be true?<br>
              <br>
              The elegance of the Internet is that it can expand an
              organization's reach - including across RIR boundaries, so
              who cares if a web server or a virtual server (or
              whatever) that is physically located in the ARIN region is
              access by tons of folks outside the region.   There just
              needs to be a legal presence and contact information to go
              along with that allocation.  Trying to apply some test
              such as majority or plurality will just cause unnecessary
              complexity and the current policies are complex enough
              without needlessly adding to it.  My 2 cents.<br>
              <br>
              Steven Ryerse<br>
              President<br>
              100 Ashford Center North, Suite 110, Atlanta, GA  30338<br>
              <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="tel:770.656.1460">770.656.1460</a> -
              Cell<br>
              <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="tel:770.399.9099">770.399.9099</a>-
              Office<br>
              <br>
              <span style="font-family:"MS Mincho"">℠</span>
              Eclipse Networks, Inc.<br>
                                   Conquering Complex Networks<span
                style="font-family:"MS Mincho"">℠</span><o:p></o:p></p>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><br>
                <br>
                -----Original Message-----<br>
                From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:arin-ppml-bounces@arin.net">arin-ppml-bounces@arin.net</a>
                [mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:arin-ppml-bounces@arin.net">arin-ppml-bounces@arin.net</a>]
                On Behalf Of John Curran<o:p></o:p></p>
            </div>
            <div>
              <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Sent:
                Tuesday, October 08, 2013 1:16 PM<br>
                To: Frank Bulk<br>
                Cc: <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:arin-ppml@arin.net">arin-ppml@arin.net</a>><br>
                Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2013-6:
                Allocation of IPv4 and IPv6 Address Space to
                Out-of-region Requestors - Revised<o:p></o:p></p>
            </div>
            <div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal">On Oct 8, 2013, at 9:26 AM, Frank
                  Bulk <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                    href="mailto:frnkblk@iname.com">frnkblk@iname.com</a>><br>
                  wrote:<br>
                  <br>
                  > John,<br>
                  ><br>
                  > What if Acme Hosting, Inc., located in the
                  Silicon Valley, found a<br>
                  > niche offering virtualized servers for Asian
                  customers who want to<br>
                  > have their Internet-based services hosted more
                  closely to the North American market.<br>
                  ><br>
                  > Acme Hosting and their infrastructure are clearly
                  in the U.S., but<br>
                  > their customers are not in the ARIN region.<br>
                  <br>
                  Their physical infrastructure would only qualify for
                  modest address space in accordance with policy, and
                  this would not change with the addition of virtualized
                  servers on existing equipment.<br>
                  <br>
                  > Does the policy, as currently written, preclude
                  Acme Hosting from<br>
                  > requesting more address space as their Asian
                  customer base grows?<br>
                  <br>
                  Under current policy, they may request additional
                  addresses as their customers grow.  Under the current
                  revised policy text, we would not consider their
                  customers who are not in region.  This side effect
                  (hosting companies not being able to consider
                  customers who are out of region) may or may not be
                  desirable, but is understandable given the additional
                  of customer region as criteria.<br>
                  <br>
                  FYI,<br>
                  /John<br>
                  <br>
                  John Curran<br>
                  President and CEO<br>
                  ARIN<br>
                  <br>
                  _______________________________________________<br>
                  PPML<br>
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                  PPML<br>
                  You are receiving this message because you are
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          <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        </div>
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      <br>
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      <br>
      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
PPML
You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net">ARIN-PPML@arin.net</a>).
Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
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Please contact <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:info@arin.net">info@arin.net</a> if you experience any issues.</pre>
    </blockquote>
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