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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Since currently ARIN policy implements the needs-basis, isn’t mentioning that requirement in 2011-1 redundant? Or are you concerned that some ARIN policies might remove the needs-basis requirement and you want to preserve the requirement in the inter-RIR transfer?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Frank<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> arin-ppml-bounces@arin.net [mailto:arin-ppml-bounces@arin.net] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Owen DeLong<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, May 24, 2011 12:47 AM<br><b>To:</b> Scott Leibrand<br><b>Cc:</b> ARIN-PPML List<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [arin-ppml] Integrating Draft Policy ARIN-2011-1 into NRPM 8.3<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>I still would prefer to see the needs-basis comment preserved as well.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Owen<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On May 23, 2011, at 10:07 PM, Scott Leibrand wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>So perhaps:<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>+ to another RIR, for transfer to a specified recipient in that RIR's service region, if both RIRs agree and the request meets both RIRs' transfer policies.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I agree it's useful to preserve discretion. I think I might prefer this to the text I originally had below... Thoughts?<br><br>Scott<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>On May 23, 2011, at 9:56 PM, Owen DeLong <<a href="mailto:owen@delong.com">owen@delong.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal>I prefer to preserve the safety valve of requiring agreement from both RIRs.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Owen<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On May 23, 2011, at 8:53 PM, Frank Bulk wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Why don’t we change the second point to:</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>+ to another RIR, for transfer to a specified recipient in that RIR's service<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>region, if the request meets both RIRS’ transfer policies.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Frank</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt;border-width:initial;border-color:initial'><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#888888'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt;border-width:initial;border-color:initial'><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>----- Original Message -----</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:#E4E4E4'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span class=apple-converted-space><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span></span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><a href="mailto:scottleibrand@gmail.com" target="_blank" title="scottleibrand@gmail.com">Scott Leibrand</a></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>To:</span></b><span class=apple-converted-space><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span></span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><a href="mailto:owen@delong.com" target="_blank" title="owen@delong.com">Owen DeLong</a></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Cc:</span></b><span class=apple-converted-space><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span></span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><a href="mailto:arin-ppml@arin.net" target="_blank" title="arin-ppml@arin.net">ARIN-PPML List</a></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sent:</span></b><span class=apple-converted-space><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span></span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Monday, May 23, 2011 5:21 PM</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Subject:</span></b><span class=apple-converted-space><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span></span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Re: [arin-ppml] Integrating Draft Policy ARIN-2011-1 into NRPM 8.3</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Mon, May 23, 2011 at 2:05 PM, Owen DeLong <<a href="mailto:owen@delong.com">owen@delong.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I could support this, but, I have a couple of lingering concerns.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I think that the last sentence dictates too much in the case of a transfer to another region and should only apply to transfers within the ARIN region.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Yeah, I was wondering about that myself. Possible slight revision inline below...<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt;border-width:initial;border-color:initial'><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>On May 23, 2011, at 15:54, Scott Leibrand <<a href="mailto:scottleibrand@gmail.com">scottleibrand@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>In light of the discomfort a number of community and AC members feel with the original 2011-1 text, I thought I'd make an attempt at integrating it into the framework of NRPM 8.3, to see if the result would be tighter and less ambiguous. Here's what I came up with:<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>8.3. Transfers to Specified Recipients<br><br>In addition to transfers under section 8.2, IPv4 number resources may be released to ARIN by the authorized resource holder, in whole or in part, for transfer:<o:p></o:p></p></div><ul style='margin-top:0in' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'>to a specified organizational recipient within the ARIN region, or <o:p></o:p></li><li class=MsoNormal style='mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'>to another RIR, for transfer to a specified organizational recipient in that RIR's service region, if the two RIRs agree and maintain compatible, needs-based transfer policies.<o:p></o:p></li></ul><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Such transferred number resources may only be received under RSA by organizations that can demonstrate the need for such resources, as a single aggregate, in the exact amount which they can justify under current ARIN policies. <o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>How about "<span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Such number resources may only be received under RSA by organizations that can demonstrate the need for such resources, as a single aggregate, in the exact amount which they can justify under current ARIN, or recipient RIR, policies." ?</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Or, feel free to suggest text...</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>-Scott</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt;border-width:initial;border-color:initial'><div><div><div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>For reference, existing policy reads:<br>8.3. Transfers to Specified Recipients<br><br>In addition to transfers under section 8.2, IPv4 number resources within the ARIN region may be released to ARIN by the authorized resource holder, in whole or in part, for transfer to another specified organizational recipient. Such transferred number resources may only be received under RSA by organizations that are within the ARIN region and can demonstrate the need for such resources, as a single aggregate, in the exact amount which they can justify under current ARIN policies.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>And original 2011-1 text reads:<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Any RIR's resource registrant may transfer IPv4 addresses to the resource registrant of another RIR as long as the two RIRs agree and maintain compatible, needs-based transfer policies that exercise Internet stewardship consistent with the values expressed in RFC2050.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________<br>PPML<br>You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to<br>the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (<a href="mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net">ARIN-PPML@arin.net</a>).<br>Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:<br><a href="http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml">http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml</a><br>Please contact<span class=apple-converted-space> </span><a href="mailto:info@arin.net">info@arin.net</a><span class=apple-converted-space> </span>if you experience any issues.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></blockquote></div></blockquote></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><hr size=2 width="100%" align=center></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________<br>PPML<br>You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to<br>the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (<a href="mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net">ARIN-PPML@arin.net</a>).<br>Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:<br><a href="http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml">http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml</a><br>Please contact<span class=apple-converted-space> </span><a href="mailto:info@arin.net">info@arin.net</a><span class=apple-converted-space> </span>if you experience any issues.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></blockquote></div></blockquote></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>_______________________________________________<br>PPML<br>You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to<br>the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (<a href="mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net">ARIN-PPML@arin.net</a>).<br>Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:<br><a href="http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml">http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml</a><br>Please contact<span class=apple-converted-space> </span><a href="mailto:info@arin.net">info@arin.net</a><span class=apple-converted-space> </span>if you experience any issues.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></blockquote><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________<br>PPML<br>You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to<br>the ARIN Public Policy Mailing List (<a href="mailto:ARIN-PPML@arin.net">ARIN-PPML@arin.net</a>).<br>Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:<br><a href="http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml">http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml</a><br>Please contact <a href="mailto:info@arin.net">info@arin.net</a> if you experience any issues.<o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal>= <o:p></o:p></p></div></body></html>