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<TITLE>/24 assignments to multi-homed customers who can't justify the use of >126 hosts in 3-6 months</TITLE>
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<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>Hello Jon,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>Thank you for posting your messages to the ARIN public
policy</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>mailing list.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001>
<DIV><SPAN class=538143418-15032001><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT
size=2><SPAN class=720381619-15032001>> </SPAN>I sent email directly to ARIN
and also phoned the registration help desk. In both situations I
was</FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=538143418-15032001><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT
size=2><SPAN class=720381619-15032001>></SPAN> informed that ARIN does
not allocate or allow others to allocate netblocks based on routing
needs.</FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>This is an accurate account of the current situation. ARIN follows
the</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>assignment guidelines outlined in RFC 2050, paragraph 3.1. In
summary,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>end-users will be assigned a block of IP address space based on their
</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>immediate </FONT></SPAN><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT
face="Courier New" color=#0000ff size=2>requirements and one year
projections. The organization needs </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>to </FONT></SPAN><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New"
color=#0000ff size=2>demonstrate 25% of their assignment will be utilized
immediately and</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>that they have a projected one year need for 50% of the assignment
size</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>they receive. This is the guideline ARIN follows when reviewing
the</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>reassignments ISPs have made to their downstream end-user
customers.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New"><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT size=2><SPAN
class=720381619-15032001>> </SPAN>As far as I see it, for the Internet
community as a whole, there are two solutions:</FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=538143418-15032001><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT
size=2><SPAN class=720381619-15032001>> </SPAN>1) ARIN needs to change its
policy to accommodate institutions that have a need to be multi-homed,
or,</FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=538143418-15032001><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT
size=2><SPAN class=720381619-15032001>> </SPAN>2) ISPs need to modify their
routing policies to allow advertisements longer than a
/24.</FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>Of course, ARIN is not in a position to comment on the second
proposed</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>solution listed above. In regard to the first proposed solution,
however,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>ARIN welcomes comments from all interested parties. Policies
in the ARIN</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>region are formed through open policy discussions that take place on
mailing</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>lists like this one and public policy meetings held twice yearly.
The next</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>public policy meeting will be held early next month. Information
about this</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>meeting can be found at <A
href="http://www.arin.net/meetings/index.html">http://www.arin.net/meetings/index.html</A></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>To be clear, is your first proposal above to consider /24 assignments
by</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2>ISPs justified based solely on the multi-homing requirements of the
customer?</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001></SPAN><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT
face="Courier New" color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001>> It would be interesting if ARIN could share the
number of ASNs that have been registered within the last year.
</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>This information is available at <A
href="http://www.arin.net/regserv/IPStats.html">http://www.arin.net/regserv/IPStats.html</A></SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001>> If the appropriate parties at ARIN could project
the number of ASNs that will be registered</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001>> over the next few years..
</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>A presentation entitled, "AS Number
Depletion," was presented by Scott Marcus</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>at the </SPAN></FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001>ARIN public policy meeting in October 2000. This
presentation may </SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>provide </SPAN></FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001>some of the information you are looking for. It
can be found at</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001> <A
href="http://www.arin.net/minutes/public/arinvi/ARIN_VI_PPM.htm">http://www.arin.net/minutes/public/arinvi/ARIN_VI_PPM.htm</A></SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>Again, thank you for posting your messages
to the public policy mailing</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>list. All parties interested in this
subject are invited to make</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>comments.</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001><FONT face=Arial
size=2></FONT></SPAN></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001><FONT face=Arial size=2>Richard
Jimmerson</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>Director of Operations</FONT>
<BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>American Registry for Internet Numbers (ARIN)</FONT>
</DIV></SPAN></FONT></SPAN>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=720381619-15032001><FONT face="Courier New" color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma
size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> owner-ppml@arin.net
[mailto:owner-ppml@arin.net]<B>On Behalf Of
</B>jforeman@bbo.com<BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, March 15, 2001 1:51
PM<BR><B>To:</B> ppml@arin.net<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: /24 assignments to
multi-homed customers who can't justify the us e of >126 hosts in 3-6
months<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001>Hi,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>I
received some informative responses from members of this list regarding the
initial message I sent (see below). Could someone from ARIN please respond
with your thoughts on this matter?</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>I
sent email directly to ARIN and also phoned the registration help desk. In
both situations I was informed that ARIN does not allocate or allow others to
allocate netblocks based on routing needs.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>As
far as I see it, for the Internet community as a whole, there are two
solutions:</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>1)
ARIN needs to change its policy to accommodate institutions that have a need
to be multi-homed, or,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>2)
ISPs need to modify their routing policies to allow advertisements longer than
a /24.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>In
my opinion, the most viable solution is the first one mentioned above. In
order to implement solution #2, you'd have to get all of the ISPs that are out
there to change their routing policies. This is much more difficult than
having one organization (ARIN) make the change.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>The
additional problem with solution #2 is: if ISPs change their routing policies
to allow advertisements longer than a /24, can their routers accommodate the
increased size of the Internet routing table? Probably not, since that is why
the /24 policies are in place.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>Of
course, the main problem with solution #1 is that certain netblocks will be
inefficiently allocated. However, most customers that are multi-homed
typically have enough hosts to require a /24 netblock or larger, so in all
likelihood, there probably won't be many institutions that can't justify a /24
but need to be multi-homed.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=538143418-15032001>It
would be interesting if ARIN could share the number of ASNs that have been
registered within the last year. Based on my experience over the last 2 years
installing BGP customers at ISPs, I would estimate that, at the very high end,
10% of institutions that aim to be multi-homed will require a larger netblock
than they can justify in order to accommodate those routing needs. If the
appropriate parties at ARIN could project the number of ASNs that will be
registered over the next few years.. you could calculate how many networks/IPs
will be inefficiently allocated and see what sort of impact a policy change
would have.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=538143418-15032001>Thanks,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jon Foreman</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>BBO
-</FONT> <FONT face=Arial size=2>Service Activation Engineer</FONT> <BR><FONT
face=Arial size=2>jforeman@bbo.com</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>Desk:
703.641.6451</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>Mobile: 703.403.4263</FONT>
<BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>Pager: 7034034263@message.bam.com</FONT> </P>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma
size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> jforeman@bbo.com
[mailto:jforeman@bbo.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Friday, March 09, 2001 2:35
PM<BR><B>To:</B> ppml@arin.net<BR><B>Subject:</B> /24 assignments to
multi-homed customers who can't justify the us e of >126 hosts in 3-6
months<BR><BR></DIV></FONT>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>All,</FONT> </P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>For a customer of an ISP that meets the following
criteria:</FONT> </P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>1) has registered an ASN and will be multi-homed
to two or more ISPs,</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>2) cannot reasonably
justify the use of a /24 within 3 - 6 months based on ARIN IP allocation
policies and</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>3) the customer is obtaining
IP space from one of their ISPs.</FONT> </P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>In my view, such a customer will require at least
a /24 so that their network advertisement will be accepted by all ISPs since
most ISPs will not accept advertisements from their peers of networks
have a netmask any longer than a /24.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>Is it acceptable, in ARIN's view, to assign a /24
to such a customer? I never came across any documentation at www.arin.net
that discusses such a situation.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>Thanks, </FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jon Foreman</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
size=2>BBO - Data Install</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial
size=2>jforeman@bbo.com</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>Desk:
703.641.6451</FONT> <BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>Mobile: 703.403.4263</FONT>
<BR><FONT face=Arial size=2>Pager: 7034034263@message.bam.com</FONT>
</P></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>