[arin-ppml] Request for Comment & Feedback: Draft Policy ARIN-2025-3: Change Section 9 Out Of Region Use Minimum Criteria

Mon Jul 20 12:08:01 EDT 2026

Grandfathered in may not be the proper term but it is an active argument.
Now John may not know this, but I received a large number of addresses in
the USA through InterNIC when I was 12. It was justifiable and granted.

Restrictions, reverse dns and other problems came there after when ARIN was
formed. Then I began to get threats for $2500 to $5000 but I refused to opt
in.

Does one exempt or simply apply new rules where you seem to have forcibly
opted in…

On Mon, Jul 13, 2026 at 8:46 AM John Curran <jcurran at arin.net> wrote:

> Kat -
>
> That’s an excellent reminder - Let me jump in here and be fairly specific
> in the concerns:
>
> a)  Terminology: best to avoid term "grandfathering in” – it’s unnecessary
> gerontological terminology so just omit.
>
> b)  Regarding handling existing entries on the wait list – be explicit
> regarding their handling if changing policies that affect wait list
> processing.  Entries on the list can be handled differently (out of respect
> for existing status) or may handled according to updated policy – just be
> clear about the intention either way.
>
>
> Thanks!
> /John
>
> John Curran
> President and CEO
> American Registry for Internet Numbers
>
>
> On Jul 13, 2026, at 1:42 PM, Kat Hunter <takokat81 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I would highly recommend removing any language that refers to
> "grandfathering in". Perhaps "will be exempt until they are removed from
> the waitlist" but grandfathered in will not pass a staff and
> legal/community review. We have seen this turned down for a number of
> reasons in the past.
>
> Kat Hunter
> Comcast/AC Chair
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 13, 2026 at 12:54 PM Tom Fantacone via ARIN-PPML <
> arin-ppml at arin.net> wrote:
>
>> Correction - my last sentence should have read:
>>
>> "Using the term "transfer market" as in *Option 1 *is bound to create
>> ambiguity since the term is not defined anywhere in the NRPM."
>>
>> Speaking of ambiguity...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Tom Fantacone via ARIN-PPML <arin-ppml at arin.net>
>> To: "Gerry George"<ggeorge at digisolv.com>
>> Cc: "ARIN PPML"<arin-ppml at arin.net>
>> Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2026 10:48:48 -0600
>> Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Request for Comment & Feedback: Draft Policy
>> ARIN-2025-3: Change Section 9 Out Of Region Use Minimum Criteria
>>
>> Gerry,
>>
>> Thanks for the clarifications.
>>
>> I support the policy as written in Option 2.  It's very clear and
>> explicit.
>>
>> Using the term "transfer market" as in Option 2 is bound to create
>> ambiguity since the term is not defined anywhere in the NRPM.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Tom Fantacone
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Gerry George via ARIN-PPML <arin-ppml at arin.net>
>> To: "ARIN PPML"<arin-ppml at arin.net>
>> Date: Mon, 13 Jul 2026 08:11:45 -0600
>> Subject: [arin-ppml] Request for Comment & Feedback: Draft Policy
>> ARIN-2025-3: Change Section 9 Out Of Region Use Minimum Criteria
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARIN-PPML
>> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
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>> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
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>> Please contact info at arin.net if you experience any issues.
>>
>> Good day and greetings, ARIN community.
>>
>> We had a suggestion for some modified text to the Draft Policy, primarily
>> in response to feedback and reactions from ARIN 57 and PPML discussions, as
>> many of the concerns related to potential gaming of the system to access
>> the ARIN address pool for out-of-region use.  The brief background and
>> suggested change text is as follows:
>>
>> As a reminder, this proposal is to modify the following text in Section 9:
>>
>>   *   FROM: IPv4: At least a /22 used in region.
>>   *   TO: IPv4: At least a /24 used in region.
>>
>>
>> The intent is to amend the proposal, including text to specifically
>> exclude out of region usage as justification to get IPv4 from the waiting
>> list.
>>
>> Suggested text - Option 1:
>>
>>
>> *Out of Region usage justification can only be used to acquire IPv4
>> addresses from the transfer market.  Any organization on the Waiting List
>> at the time this policy is implemented will be grandfathered-in.*
>> Suggested text - Option 2:
>>
>> *Out of Region usage justification may not be used to receive IPv4
>> addresses from the ARIN Waitlist (4.1.8), Micro-allocation pool (4.4) or
>> Dedicated IPv4 Allocation to facilitate IPv6 Deployment (4.10).  Any
>> organization on the Waiting List at the time this policy is implemented
>> will be grandfathered-in.*
>>
>> The first option is shorter, and does not specifically refer to ARIN
>> reserve pools, which could change.  The second option does not include the
>> term “transfer market”.  That term does not appear in the NRPM, and
>> directly mentions the waiting list.
>>
>>
>> The full change to the policy will thus be:
>>
>> Problem Statement
>>
>> Section 9
>> <https://www.arin.net/participate/policy/nrpm/#9-out-of-region-use> of
>> the NRPM, Out of Region Use, requires organizations to use at least a /22
>> in the ARIN region before they can justify out of region use. This harms
>> smaller organizations that have less than a /22 in region but do require
>> some out of region use.
>> Policy Statement
>>
>> Modify the following text in Section 9
>> <https://www.arin.net/participate/policy/nrpm/#9-out-of-region-use>:
>> FROM:
>> IPv4: At least a /22 used in region.
>> TO:
>>  IPv4: At least a /24 used in region.
>>
>>
>> ADDITIONAL TEXT:
>>
>> Out of Region usage justification can only be used to acquire IPv4
>> addresses from the transfer market.
>> Any organization already on the Waiting List at the time this policy is
>> implemented will be exempted and shall remain eligible under the rules in
>> effect at the time of its placement on the Waiting List.
>> [Organizations on the Waiting List at the time this policy takes effect
>> shall be exempted and will not be affected by this change.]
>>
>> OR
>>
>> Out-of-Region Usage Justification may not be used to receive IPv4 address
>> space from the ARIN Waiting List (4.1.8), the Micro-allocation Pool (4.4),
>> or the Dedicated IPv4 Block to Facilitate IPv6 Deployment (4.10).
>> Any organization already on the Waiting List at the time this policy is
>> implemented will be exempted and shall remain eligible under the rules in
>> effect at the time of its placement on the Waiting List.
>> [Organizations on the Waiting List at the time this policy takes effect
>> shall be exempted and will not be affected by this change.]
>>
>>
>> Note the text in square brackets suggests the intent of the last
>> sentence, and may be considered for substitution for brevity.
>>
>>
>> Please submit your comments of support, dissent, encouragement or
>> disapproval for the policy, and for the proposed text changes.
>>
>>
>> Regards
>>
>>
>> *Gerry E. George*
>> ICT Consultant and Business Solutions Architect;
>> *DigiSolv, Inc.* [P.O. Box 1677, Castries, Saint Lucia]
>> ------------------------------
>> *Email: **ggeorge at digisolv.com <ggeorge at digisolv.com>*
>> *Mobile (WhatsApp)*: (758) 728-4858 /* Int'l Office*: (347) 450-3444
>> *Web*: https://digisolv.com <ggeorge at digisolv.com>  */ **LinkedIn: **https://linkedin.com/in/gerrygeorge/
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/gerrygeorge/>*
>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>> _______________________________________________
>> ARIN-PPML
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>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> ARIN-PPML
>> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
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>>
> _______________________________________________
> ARIN-PPML
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>
> _______________________________________________
> ARIN-PPML
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