[arin-ppml] ARIN-PPML Digest, Vol 254, Issue 3

[Quantum]

Hi Eddie,

On 2026/8/6 13:40, Eddie Stauble via ARIN-PPML wrote:
> Disallowing out of region justification for those with less than a /22 in
> region is an issue for anyone with less than a /22, whether they are looking
> to get addresses from a broker or private transfer.  Not all 8.3 transfers
> are through brokers. The original part of this proposal was strictly about
> who can use their out of region need for justification, not about how they
> were going to get the addresses.

My original question was not about the impact of the current NRPM 
section 9 on brokers versus private transfers. Rather, it was about that 
between /transfers in general/ versus /the waiting list./ Specifically, 
I wrote:

> What I am struggling to understand is why this is a problem only for 
> users of IPv4 brokers and not users of the *IPv4 waiting list.* If the 
> same small company wanted to use the *ARIN waiting list* instead of 
> purchasing IPv4 space from you, they would run into the exact same 
> problem.
If the proposal was solely about helping those who do not have a /22 in 
region, regardless of *how they were going to get the addresses* (your 
words), why are we now restricting the remedy to only those who use 
brokers and private transfers, and denying the remedy to those who use 
the waiting list? After all, any user of the ARIN waiting list will 
experience the exact same problem.

Why does one group deserve the remedy and the other doesn't? I think 
this fundamentally grants one group of ARIN members more privilege than 
the other. I firmly believe that all ARIN members should be allowed to 
do the same thing with their space. The waiting list is not a special 
pool those reserved for NRPM sections 4.4 and 4.10 and shouldn't have 
special restrictions.

In fact, this latest amendment goes beyond not granting the remedy to 
users of the waiting list: it deprives the users of the waiting list of 
a justification they were previously able to use, when they have more 
than a /22 in region. So really, this is harming one group of ARIN 
members to benefit another group.

> I don't have any ulterior motives in proposing this; I sell an IPv4 block
> either way.

I've never suggested that you had any ulterior motives. I merely wanted 
to remind you that users of the waiting list experience the same issue. 
Your original proposal would help many ARIN members and I am not opposed 
to it.

>   I just see  the requirement of a /22 for in region use to be
> discriminatory against the little guy.

And I see the new amendment as discriminatory against those 
organizations who use the waiting list instead of the "transfer market", 
i.e. IP brokers or private transfers. The amendment forces any ARIN 
member with a /22 in region who would have qualified to use the waiting 
list for space out of region to either:

 1. use a different RIR; or
 2. buy IP space on the transfer market instead, which costs a lot more
    than the waiting list that they are currently able to use.

If we cared about the little guy, why are we doing this to them?

Remember, anyone who uses the ARIN waiting list /is/ the little guy in 
the grand scheme of things. To quote NRPM section 4.1.8:

> Organizations which hold more than a /20 equivalent of IPv4 space in 
> aggregate (exclusive of special use space received under section 4.4 
> or 4.10) are not eligible to apply.

I oppose this amendment to the proposal, and if this amendment is to be 
bundled with the original proposal, then I have no choice but to oppose 
the whole thing.

Best regards,
Quantum
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