[arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2021-6: Remove Circuit Requirement

Noah noah at neo.co.tz
Wed Sep 22 02:49:47 EDT 2021

On Wed, 22 Sep 2021, 02:56 Mike Burns, <mike at iptrading.com> wrote:

> Hi Noah,
> Will you concede that lessors and lessees are willingly engaging in
> leasing today?

There is no such thing. You are calling end-user assignments and
suballocations that result from LIR/ISP connectivity services... leasing.
No connectivity no IP address, no need.

That will cut out the examples and cut to the chase.
> There is no need to look for hidden motivations.
> Here are the motivations as I see them, with direct experience in these
> matters from many levels.
> Address holders no longer fear IPv6 apocalypse in the near- to mid-term.
> Addresses are skyrocketing in value, now over $60 at times.
> Your generous LIR on the list would be committing over $250,000 in value
> to this WISP if they designate a /20 for their use.

So a WISP would happily pay $250,000 for a lease? Rather than obtain
connectivity service from an LIR and get a /24 or /23 based on real need.

I am struggling to see how small WISP would find leasing more strategic yet
they would end up paying more to cover also the cost of middlemen.

Some small ISPs and end-users can't get addresses from their upstream LIRs
> and need to get them on the market.
> The price is shocking and sometimes just not affordable, or if affordable,
> would require reduced spending elsewhere in the project.

This market you talk off, where is it and who are the LIR with so much Idle
addresses to cash out?

So they choose to lease, and address holders are happy to monetize their
> holdings while they appreciate in value.

By address holders you mean LIR. So what you are saying is that some LIR
out there who requested for IPv4 based on need from ARIN, are holding the
addresses which they no longer need artificially? So that they can lease to
small WISP?

So that the purpose for which those LIR obtained the addresses in the first

Suppose the addresses those LIR are holding with no intension to use them,
were still under ARIN management, dont you think the new small WISP would
have better off being served by ARIN as new needs arise.?

If LIR dont pay ARIN lots of money, why not return the idle addresses to
ARIN so that those with genuine need can be served.

> There is nothing mysterious about any of it.

There is alot of mystery and bad faith contrary to what the internet
community expected from address management for best interest of everyone.


> Regards,

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