[arin-ppml] Change of Use and ARIN (was: Re: AFRINIC And The Stability Of The Internet Number Registry System)

Mark McDonald markm at siteserver.com
Wed Sep 15 20:18:31 EDT 2021


Ahhh, those were the days.

-Mark

> On Sep 15, 2021, at 5:08 PM, Mark Andrews <marka at isc.org> wrote:
> 
> I got my first 4 blocks (1 class B, and 3 class C blocks (pre-CIDR) in 4 different sites in 4 cities in 4 states) of addresses in ’88 (I know the year because my NIC handle was MA88 and I had noted that both where 88, a coincidence but just the same memorable). Even then there where formal procedures. The organisation was noted in whois.  You where expected to keep those records up to date. Yes, I know Jon did allocate some addresses less formally but most of the pre-ARIN allocations where formally recorded.
> 
> Mark
> 
>> On 16 Sep 2021, at 03:59, Martin Hannigan <hannigan at gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Hi Paul,
>> 
>> It was interesting reading about your problem, your take on matters, the experience and history with ARIN. Thank you for that.
>> 
>> While I can appreciate ARIN's position from the perspective of 'how do they know', I can appreciate yours too. We're not talking about criminal courts and beyond reasonable doubts. Jon Postel's pre RIR legacy assignments are hand written in a notebook. If that's good enough documentation to establish legacy assignment then providing "reasonable" proof that an address was provided for legitimate use would make a lot of sense to me. However, and admittedly, it's not that simple. Mostly because we don't want it to be. To some extent, because it can't be. You are a victim of "progress".
>> 
>> Warm regards, and good luck;
>> 
>> -M<
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Wed, Sep 15, 2021 at 1:05 PM Paul E McNary via ARIN-PPML <arin-ppml at arin.net> wrote:
>> I need to make a slight correction.
>> I am semi retired from our Internet company and my son runs the show.
>> He is a triple major Engineer and is PE certifiable in each of the 3 areas.
>> He says he has deployed IPv6 to subscribers.
>> But Simple and Cheap NO.
>> 5 years and a complete forklift to all subscribers.
>> The issues happens at the head end router.
>> My son is an University educated Enginner.
>> His under graduate work was in Network Engineering.
>> He was offered a bypass of Master's Degree and go straight into PHD Network Engineering
>> Graduated Summa Cum Laude, so he's not an Idiot
>> Well maybe he is. He choose our WISP over the PHD.
>> He says IPv6 does work for the last mile but on our redundant backhaul loops it has some shortcomings.
>> And our multi-homing has some issues with IPv6.
>> 
>> Thought I would make these corrections.
>> Just an old, fat, grumpy guy and former Guru that has outlived his usefulness
>> Paul McNary
>> 
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "arin-ppml" <arin-ppml at arin.net>
>> To: scott at solarnetone.org
>> Cc: "arin-ppml" <arin-ppml at arin.net>
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2021 11:44:09 AM
>> Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Change of Use and ARIN (was: Re: AFRINIC And The Stability Of The Internet Number Registry System)
>> 
>>> On Sep 14, 2021, at 22:50 , scott at solarnetone.org wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Tue, 14 Sep 2021, Owen DeLong wrote:
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Sep 14, 2021, at 22:42 , scott at solarnetone.org wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Nobody I know has found a way to do lossless packing of 128 bits into a 32 bit field yet. Until you can achieve that, compatibility is rather limited.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Please present your solution here.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Encode it in four sequential packets, 32 bits per, and add logic to parse those malformed addresses in the routing daemons.
>>>> 
>>>> Either I’m missing something, or that’s not going to be functional when those 4 packets reach the IPv4-Only end host and it has to reply.
>>> 
>>> Maybe, but that is not the challenge you presented:)
>> 
>> Fair enough… In context, the challenge I presented was about getting an IPv4-only host with no changes to software to be able to engage
>> in bidirectional communication with remote hosts that live in a 128 bit address space. Yes, you are correct the the way I abbreviated my
>> expression of that particular challenge was not complete in itself without the additional context.
>> 
>>> Seriously, some manner of stateful 6/4 nat or header mangling is going to be required upstream of the legacy device to translate.
>> 
>> Yeah, but because of the way IPv4 has been implemented (protocols that embed addresses, expectations of dealing with rendezvous
>> hosts, NAT traversal assumptions, etc.), it turns out that evenstateful 6/4 NAT is unnecessarily hard and unreliable at best.
>> 
>> Owen
>> 
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> 
> -- 
> Mark Andrews, ISC
> 1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia
> PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742              INTERNET: marka at isc.org
> 
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