[arin-ppml] [EXT] Re: Open Petition for ARIN-prop-266: BGP Hijacking is an ARIN Policy Violation

[Marilson Mapa]

> I have no opposition to doing something if we can get a proposal that
offers something that ARIN can do.
> The first step must be to identify what ARIN can do and accept what is
beyond ARIN’s mandate and capabilities.

Owen, this is a position that will certainly be supported by all who have
endured prop-266. With respect to items 3, 4 and 5 of your pronouncement,
punitive rules could be imposed by ARIN in order to reduce illicit acts.

Marilson


Em sáb, 4 de mai de 2019 às 16:09, Owen DeLong <owen at delong.com> escreveu:

>
>
> > On May 3, 2019, at 10:13 , Carlos Friaças via ARIN-PPML <
> arin-ppml at arin.net> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> >
> > On Fri, 3 May 2019, Andrew Bagrin wrote:
> >
> >> I'm curious why do people not want to let ARIN try to start getting
> involved to help resolve the issue of hijacking?
>
> I don’t accept the premise of the question. I think people are perfectly
> willing to see ARIN expand its involvement in
> resolving issues of hijacking to the extent that ARIN can have a
> meaningful impact on the situation. I think others
> in this discussion have a greatly inflated opinion of ARIN’s powers and
> capabilities in this regard.
>
> >
> > <proposer hat on>
> >
> > This is uncharted territory. Some people fear the unknown.
>
> I think that is overly dismissive and an inaccurate assessment of most of
> the opposition to this proposal.
>
> Indeed, IMHO, this is  actually well charted territory as similar
> discussions of ARIN’s ability to curtail routing
> problems have been held before in this and other fora with the consistent
> outcome that after a period of education,
> most in the discussion arrive at the same conclusion:
>
>         1.      Most of the resource hijackers are not those who have
> contracts with ARIN with one notable exception.
>         2.      Those with a contract with ARIN generally are those who
> have committed resource fraud in order to
>                 obtain said contract with ARIN and upon sufficient proof,
> ARIN already has policies and procedures
>                 in place to reclaim the resources.
>         3.      Stopping hijacking requires an action by those who run
> routers. ARIN does not run (many) routers.
>         4.      ARIN does not control the businesses who run routers.
>         5.      ARIN does not have the authority to dictate business
> practices to ISPs beyond those related to the
>                 maintenance of the ARIN registration database.
>         6.      The theory that ARIN allocates exclusive rights to use
> number resources on some amorphous
>                 concept known as “the global internet” is a novel idea,
> but not particularly proximal to reality.
>
> >> Why would anyone be against ARIN having a process to help resolve these
> issues?  Sure we can question how effective it will be, but anything will
> be more effective than nothing, and by actually doing, failing and
> learning, ARIN will only improve and refine the process. We will all learn
> from this.
> >
> > I've learned a lot between proposal versions in RIPE, LACNIC and ARIN.
>
> I have no opposition to doing something if we can get a proposal that
> offers something that ARIN can do.
>
> The first step must be to identify what ARIN can do and accept what is
> beyond ARIN’s mandate and capabilities.
>
> Owen
>
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