[arin-ppml] Beneficial Owners
Ronald F. Guilmette
rfg at tristatelogic.com
Tue Jul 17 01:50:42 EDT 2018
In message <email@example.com>,
"Mike Burns" <mike at iptrading.com> wrote:
>Whereas I am sure you will get firm agreement from everybody in this
>community regarding the abuse of address space, your language leads to
>conflating the concept of ARIN-"awarded" space and purchased space that can
>be registered anywhere in North America, Europe, the Middle East, or Asia.
I hope not, by which I mean that I hope that I haven't either conflated
the two -or- that I have seemed to be all all against the notion of IP
address block transfers, e.g. via private brokerage arrangement, because
I am very much in favor of a free and open market for IPv4 space for
one simple reason: My own personal efforts have for many years concentrated
on the problem of so-called "snowshoe" spamming, where the spammers use
lots of different domain names and lost of different IP addresses to
This approach to spamming is nowadays employed by 100% of all serious
professional spammers, and their are two fuels that have driven the
explosion of snowshoe spamming over the past several years, the first
being cheap domain names... about which nothing can really be done,
I think... and the second is cheap IP addresses. It is my belief
that to the extent that IP addresses go the highest bidder, they will,
in general, -not- fall into the hands of snowshoe spammers, whose business
model only works when there are tons and tons of IPv4 addresses lying
around that can be had... and burned through... quite cheaply.
>What difference does it make if an Iranian or Pakistani citizen created a
>Delaware corp and purchased ARIN space and kept it registered in ARIN,
>versus transferring it to a RIPE or APNIC account in Iran or Pakistan?
>The addresses can be used nefariously regardless of registry. ARIN is not
>issuing space out of any free pool, so the sizes (/19, /17, whatever) are
>not really relevant...
You're right, of course. If I am abused from RIPE space or APNIC space or
AFRINIC space of LACNIC space then the abuse I suffer is neither better
nor worse that if I was abused instead from ARIN space. So I don't
really have a good response. Call it a kind of IP xenophobia on my part.
I've just come to have higher expectations with respect to ARIN resources
than those issued by other regions. And indeed, those higher expectations
-are- fulilled in most instances. I think John and his crew do a rather
better job of running a tight ship than other RIRs do, and as a result,
over the years there has been rather less funny business relating to ARIN
resources. And in what may be a perverted sort of way, that's what makes
the situtaions I've alluded to stick out... like the proverbial sore thumbs...
all the more. Because they are cases of funny business taking place in
relation to ARIN resources, and when I pull back the curtains I see folks
from other regions behind it all.
I have an emotional response in such cases, and arguably that's just stupid,
and I really shouldn't. But nontheless, sometimes I really do think... in
the heat of battle... that I'd like to build a wall and get RIPE to pay for
it. :-) I freely admit that this is not a terribly enlightened viewpoint
but nontheless I do not apologize for it.
>And what incentive is there for the creation of an American corporation and
>the receipt of ARIN space, versus purchasing ARIN/RIPE/APNIC space and
>registering it wherever you wish?
Damn good question I don't know.
I'll stop dancing around in generalities now and talk specifics and maybe
you can tell me why these folks came to ARIN as opposed to some other RIR.
This mail is already long enough, so I'll present the relevant specifics in
a separate list post to follow this one.
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