[arin-ppml] Recommended Draft Policy ARIN-2017-5: Improved IPv6 Registration Requirements
Michael Peddemors
michael at linuxmagic.com
Fri Sep 29 10:55:57 EDT 2017
+1
On 17-09-29 06:58 AM, Jason Schiller wrote:
> David, Kevin, Alison
>
> I am actually comfortable with an implementation that is short of
> revocation,
> but I am still not comfortable with "should".
>
> Should makes it optional. Officially not being out of compliance with
> ARIN policy makes it optional.
>
> I suggest that an ISP refusing to register a downstream customer
> is out of compliance with ARIN policy, and not just choosing to ignore
> an optional recommendation.
>
> If it is only "should" then an ISP can still hold the moral high ground
> while refusing to support SWIP on the grounds that they will not
> implement tooling and commit resources when it is only optional.
>
> It is a question of if you can hold someone accountable for not
> complying or if they are free to ignore something that is optional.
>
>
>
> Owen, Chris, Kevin,
>
> Certainly if there is enough support to move this forward, we shouldn't
> wait another cycle. (I recognize this weakens the "shall" position)
>
> My hope is if we can close out the discussion of this topic at the meeting
> with a clear understanding of if there is community support to move forward
> the policy with "shall" and also if there is clear support to move the
> policy forward
> with "should" in this cycle. This will give the AC a maximum of
> leverage to do
> what is needed, and insure it doesn't fall to the next cycle by forcing
> people
> to support only what they perceive as the best option.
>
> Assuming there is support for both "shall" and "should" the AC could
> choose to move "shall" to last call, and if there are then issues, move
> should to last call.
>
>
> We need to get clear on how to structure the question here.
>
> My thoughts are
>
> 1. Do you support the policy with "shall" if it doesn't require an extra
> cycle
> and support "should" in this cycle if "shall" cannot advance?
>
> 2. Do you only support the policy as written?
>
> 3. Do you oppose both the policy as written and with "shall"?
>
> When considering if there is enough support to move the policy as
> written forward, the AC should consider the hands in both questions 1 & 2.
>
>
> I support the policy with "shall" with a fall back to "should".
>
> __Jason
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 28, 2017 at 1:18 PM, David Farmer <farmer at umn.edu
> <mailto:farmer at umn.edu>> wrote:
>
> I agree with Kevin if a bigger stick is need to ensure compliance in
> the future we can take that step if/when there proves to be a
> serious non-compliance issue in the future. Personally, I'm not
> ready to threaten revocation, in this case. My intent in suggesting
> what is now 6.5.5.4 was to crate an avenue for ARIN Staff to
> intervene with ISPs on behalf of customers, if a customer wanted
> their assignment registered and their ISP refused to register their
> assignment as requested, the customer can appeal the issue to ARIN.
> I'm fine with that intervention being short of threatening
> revocation, at least until their proves to be a serious issue with
> ISP's refusing valid requests by endusers to register assignments.
> I think the current language provides the proper balance.
>
> I'm fine with the standard procedure starting with ARIN Staff
> forwarding such complaints to an ISP requesting an explanation of
> the situation. However, if this develops into a chronic matter for
> an ISP, I would expect ARIN Staff to escalate the issue beyond
> simply asking for an explanation. Further after escalation, if the
> matter continues to be chronic, I would expect eventually the
> community to be altered to the situation. Probably not the specifics
> of which ISP and customers, but at least that there is an issue and
> some sense of the situation involved.
>
> Therefore, I support the policy as written. I'm not strongly opposed
> to changing from "should" to "shall" for section 6.5.5.4, but I'd
> prefer keeping that change in reserve, so we can go there, if there
> proves to be serious issues with non-compliance in the future. Put
> another way, I think voluntary compliance is highly preferred for
> this issue, and if voluntary compliance proves insufficient, then we
> can deal with that in the future.
>
> Thanks.
>
> On Thu, Sep 28, 2017 at 10:46 AM, Kevin Blumberg <kevinb at thewire.ca
> <mailto:kevinb at thewire.ca>> wrote:
>
> I support the policy as written. ____
>
> __ __
>
> If the stick isn’t big enough it appears a simple policy change
> could be used, not just for this section but all the other areas
> “should” is used.____
>
> __ __
>
> I would like to point out that “should” is currently used 30
> times in the NRPM. ____
>
> __ __
>
> In reading John’s explanation, I can’t see “should” and “shall”
> being considered an editorial change. To extend the policy cycle
> to another meeting would be far worse.____
>
> __ __
>
> Out of curiosity, how often has ARIN had to deal with SWIP
> issues like this, where the other party ignored you?____
>
> __ __
>
> Thanks,____
>
> __ __
>
> Kevin Blumberg____
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> *From:*ARIN-PPML [mailto:arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net
> <mailto:arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net>] *On Behalf Of *John Curran
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 27, 2017 5:59 PM
> *To:* Jason Schiller <jschiller at google.com
> <mailto:jschiller at google.com>>
> *Cc:* arin-ppml at arin.net <mailto:arin-ppml at arin.net>
> *Subject:* Re: [arin-ppml] Recommended Draft Policy ARIN-2017-5:
> Improved IPv6 Registration Requirements____
>
> __ __
>
> On 26 Sep 2017, at 3:18 PM, Jason Schiller <jschiller at google.com
> <mailto:jschiller at google.com>> wrote:____
>
> __ __
>
> I oppose as written. ____
>
> __ __
>
> There should not be a different standard of requirement for:____
>
> - re-allocation____
>
> - reassignment containing a /47 or more addresses____
>
> - subdelegation of any size that will be individually
> announced____
>
> __ __
>
> which is "shall"____
>
> __ __
>
> and Registration Requested by Recipient____
>
> __ __
>
> which is "should"____
>
> __ __
>
> I would support if they are both "shall".____
>
> __ __
>
> Can ARIN staff discuss what actions it will take if an ISP's____
>
> down stream customer contacts them and explains that their____
>
> ISP refuses to SWIP their reassignment to them?____
>
> __ __
>
> Will they do anything more than reach out to the ISP and
> tell____
>
> them they "should" SWIP it?____
>
> __ __
>
> Jason -
>
> If this policy change 2017-5 is adopted, then a provider
> that has IPv6 space from ARIN ____
>
> but routinely fails to publish registration information (for
> /47 or larger reassignments) ____
>
> would be in violation, and ARIN would have clear policy
> language that would enable ____
>
> us to discuss with the ISP the need to publish this
> information in a timely manner. ____
>
>
> Service providers who blatantly ignore such a provision on
> an ongoing basis will be
> in the enviable position of hearing me chat with them about
> their obligations to follow
> ARIN number resource policy, including the consequences
> (i.e. potential revocation ____
>
> of the IPv6 number resources.)____
>
> __ __
>
> If the langauge for the new section 6.5.5.4 "Registration
> Requested by Recipient” ____
>
> reads “… the ISP should register that assignment”, then ARIN
> would send on any____
>
> received customer complaint to the ISP, and remind the ISP
> that they should____
>
> follow number resource policy in this regard but not
> otherwise taking any action. ____
>
> __ __
>
> If the language for the new section 6.5.5.4 "Registration
> Requested by Recipient” ____
>
> reads “… the ISP shall register that assignment”, then
> failure to do so would be____
>
> a far more serious matter that, if left unaddressed on a
> chronic manner, could have ____
>
> me discussing the customer complaints as a sign of potential
> failure to comply with ____
>
> number resource policy, including the consequences (i.e.
> potential revocation of ____
>
> the IPv6 number resources.)____
>
> __ __
>
> I would note that the community should be very clear about
> its intentions for ISPs____
>
> with regard to customer requested reassignment publication,
> given there is large ____
>
> difference in obligations that result from policy language
> choice. ARIN staff remains, ____
>
> as always, looking forward to implementing whatever policy
> emerges from the ____
>
> consensus-based policy development process. ____
>
> __ __
>
> Thanks!____
>
> /John____
>
> __ __
>
> John Curran____
>
> President and CEO____
>
> American Registry for Internet Numbers____
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
>
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>
> --
> ===============================================
> David Farmer Email:farmer at umn.edu <mailto:Email%3Afarmer at umn.edu>
> Networking & Telecommunication Services
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>
>
>
> --
> _______________________________________________________
> Jason Schiller|NetOps|jschiller at google.com
> <mailto:jschiller at google.com>|571-266-0006
>
>
>
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