[arin-ppml] ARIN-PPML Digest, Vol 128, Issue 11
Michael Clarke
gdiscovery at sympatico.ca
Thu Feb 18 16:47:59 EST 2016
Keep getting this e-mail - don't know what to do with it.
-----Original Message-----
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Subject: ARIN-PPML Digest, Vol 128, Issue 11
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9: Eliminating needs-based
evaluation for Section 8.2 and 8.3 transfers of IPv4 netblocks
(John Santos)
2. Re: Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9: Eliminating needs-based
evaluation for Section 8.2 and 8.3 transfers of IPv4 netblocks
(Mike Winters)
3. Re: ARIN-PPML Digest, Vol 128, Issue 7 (Mike Burns)
4. Re: ARIN-PPML Digest, Vol 128, Issue 7 (McTim)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2016 15:18:12 -0500
From: John Santos <JOHN at egh.com>
To: ARIN PPML <arin-ppml at arin.net>
Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9: Eliminating
needs-based evaluation for Section 8.2 and 8.3 transfers of IPv4
netblocks
Message-ID: <1160218151726.64084A-100000 at joonya.egh.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Opposed.
--
John Santos
Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc.
781-861-0670 ext 539
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2016 20:24:16 +0000
From: Mike Winters <mwinters at edwardrose.com>
To: 'Dani Roisman' <droisman at softlayer.com>, "arin-ppml at arin.net"
<arin-ppml at arin.net>
Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9: Eliminating
needs-based evaluation for Section 8.2 and 8.3 transfers of IPv4
netblocks
Message-ID:
<EDE6239A5447704C9889F863709AAA19173B4547 at EXCH2.charlotte.lan>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I am opposed to the proposal and think McTim sums it up very well. Also +1
to Owen, Vaughn and Jason.
What you are suggesting is akin to saying we should legalize the sale of
alcohol to minors because they are going to drink anyway, but at least we
would know who is drinking so that makes it ok.
Maybe we should consider changing policy so that ARIN can recover the IP
address of both organizations if they bypass policy.
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net [mailto:arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net] On
Behalf Of Dani Roisman
Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2016 3:08 PM
To: arin-ppml at arin.net
Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9: Eliminating needs-based
evaluation for Section 8.2 and 8.3 transfers of IPv4 netblocks
(resending to fix threading, sorry about that folks)
I support this re-write of the previous draft, and agree with the removal of
the 8.4 language at this stage (8.4 transfers should get separate attention
due to the tie-in with other RIRs). When I defended this proposal in
Montreal, I had may people come up to me after the session had ended who
expressed their support.
I would ask that those of you who *do* think the time has come to shift ARIN
focus away from an inhibiting role, and instead prioritize accurate
documentation of IPv4 market-induced transfers, please speak up now. The
ARIN AC and membership needs to hear views of not only those opposed to this
proposal.
----
Dani Roisman
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2016 15:34:49 -0500
From: Mike Burns <mike at iptrading.com>
To: Dani Roisman <droisman at softlayer.com>, "arin-ppml at arin.net"
<arin-ppml at arin.net>
Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] ARIN-PPML Digest, Vol 128, Issue 7
Message-ID: <fa27inxr28xti0b99vnj6jqr.1455827689949 at email.android.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Rent and profit seeking?
That horse has long left the barn. But it's telling that arguments against
this policy reveal themselves to be ideological in nature.
Speculation? ?Only existing in fevered imaginations. Absent in RIPE despite
its "encouragement/enablement". Still waiting for evidence of speculation,
care to share any?
I support this overdue relaxing of outdated inhibitors to normal business
practices and to accurate registration.
Mike?
Sent from my Sprint phone
<div>-------- Original message --------</div><div>From: Dani Roisman
<droisman at softlayer.com> </div><div>Date:02/18/2016 3:03 PM (GMT-05:00)
</div><div>To: arin-ppml at arin.net </div><div>Subject: Re: [arin-ppml]
ARIN-PPML Digest, Vol 128, Issue 7 </div><div> </div>I support this re-write
of the previous draft, and agree with the removal of the 8.4 language at
this stage (8.4 transfers should get separate attention due to the tie-in
with other RIRs). When I defended this proposal in Montreal, I had may
people come up to me after the session had ended who expressed their
support.
I would ask that those of you who *do* think the time has come to shift ARIN
focus away from an inhibiting role, and instead prioritize accurate
documentation of IPv4 market-induced transfers, please speak up now. The
ARIN AC and membership needs to hear views of not only those opposed to this
proposal.
----
Dani Roisman
| -----Original Message-----
| Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2016 00:12:54 +0000
| From: Leif Sawyer <lsawyer at gci.com>
| To: ARIN PPML <arin-ppml at arin.net>
| Subject: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9: Eliminating needs-based
| evaluation for Section 8.2 and 8.3 transfers of IPv4 netblocks
| Message-ID:
| <EDF941B230F4C446826CF893A9C8CE59E0DBF413 at ex-mbx-
| prd02.gci.com>
| Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252
|
| Good afternoon -
|
| Based on feedback from Montreal as well as internal discussions,
| I've reworked this policy.
| AC members and ARIN staff are looking for additional feedback, as well
| as your position in terms of supporting or opposing this draft policy.
|
| We'll be discussing this policy, as well as any feedback provided on
| this week's AC teleconference, so I'm very appreciative of your input.
|
| Thanks,
|
| Leif Sawyer
| Shepherd - ARIN-2015-9
|
| NRPM section 8: https://www.arin.net/policy/nrpm.html#eight
|
| Most current draft policy text follows:
| --
|
| Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9
| Eliminating needs-based evaluation for Section 8.2 and 8.3
| transfers of IPv4 netblocks Original Date: 23 September 2015
| Updated: 16 February, 2016
|
| Problem statement:
| The current needs-based evaluation language in NRPM sections 8.2 and
| 8.3, regarding transfer of IPv4 netblocks from one organization to
| another, may cause a recipient organization to bypass the ARIN
| registry entirely in order to secure the needed IPv4 netblocks in a
| more timely fashion directly from the current holder. The result is
| that the data visible in ARIN registry may become more inaccurate over
| time.
|
| Policy statement:
| This proposal eliminates all needs-based evaluation language for
| sections 8.2 and 8.3, allowing transfers to be reflected in the
| database as they occur following an agreement of transfer from the
| resource provider to the recipient.
|
| Section 8.1 Principles:
| - Strike the fragment from the 3rd paragraph which reads ", based on
| justified need, "
| so the resulting text reads
| "Number resources are issued to organizations, not to individuals
| representing those organizations."
| Section 8.2 Mergers and Acquisitions:
| - Change the 4th bullet from:
| "The resources to be transferred will be subject to ARIN policies."
| to:
| "The resources to be transferred will be subject to ARIN policies,
| excluding any policies related to needs-based justification."
|
| - Strike the final paragraph which begins "In the event that number
| resources of the combined organizations are no longer justified under ARIN
policy ..."
|
| Section 8.3 Transfers between Specified Recipients within the ARIN Region:
| - Change the first bullet under "Conditions on recipient of the transfer"
from:
| "The recipient must demonstrate the need for up to a 24-month supply
| of IP address resources under current ARIN policies and sign an RSA."
| to:
| "The recipient must sign an RSA."
|
| - Change the 2nd bullet under "Conditions on recipient of the transfer"
from:
| "The resources to be transferred will be subject to ARIN policies."
| to:
| "The resources to be transferred will be subject to ARIN policies,
| excluding any policies related to needs-based justification."
|
| Comments:
| a. Timetable for implementation: Immediate b. Anything else As the
| "free pool" for 4 of the 5 world's RIR's (APNIC, RIPE, LACNIC, and
| ARIN) have now been
| exhausted, networks in need of additional IPv4 addresses have shifted
| away from the practice of receiving them from the RIR's resource pool.
| Instead, networks in need are seeking out current holders of IPv4
| resources who are willing to transfer them in order to fulfill that need.
| Accordingly, the RIR's
| primary responsibility vis-?-vis IPv4 netblock governance has shifted
| from "allocation" to ensuring an accurate registry database.
|
| The RIPE registry can be used as a reference of one which has evolved
| over the past couple years to shift their focus away from
| conservation/allocation and towards database accuracy. IPv4 netblock
| transfers within that RIR consist merely of validating authenticity of
| the parties requesting a transfer.
| Provided the organizations meet the basic requirement of RIR
| membership, and that the transferring organization has the valid
| authority to request the transfer, the transaction completes without
| any "needs-based" review.
|
|
|
_______________________________________________
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Message: 4
Date: Thu, 18 Feb 2016 16:18:51 -0500
From: McTim <dogwallah at gmail.com>
To: "arin-ppml at arin.net" <arin-ppml at arin.net>
Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] ARIN-PPML Digest, Vol 128, Issue 7
Message-ID:
<CACAaNxg9Gsk59OPTSOQL62XgfOL9_CM9vcxHoVnEycK5jy+Mqg at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
On Thu, Feb 18, 2016 at 3:34 PM, Mike Burns <mike at iptrading.com> wrote:
>
> Rent and profit seeking?
> That horse has long left the barn. But it's telling that arguments against
this policy reveal themselves to be ideological in nature.
>
> Speculation? Only existing in fevered imaginations. Absent in RIPE
despite its "encouragement/enablement". Still waiting for evidence of
speculation, care to share any?
The existence of your company and other "brokers" isn't evidence enough that
people want to make money solely by buying and selling v4 resources?
Methinks you fail to see the forest for the trees!
Regards,
McTim
>
>
> I support this overdue relaxing of outdated inhibitors to normal business
practices and to accurate registration.
>
>
> Mike
>
>
>
> Sent from my Sprint phone
>
>
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Dani Roisman
> Date:02/18/2016 3:03 PM (GMT-05:00)
> To: arin-ppml at arin.net
> Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] ARIN-PPML Digest, Vol 128, Issue 7
>
> I support this re-write of the previous draft, and agree with the removal
of the 8.4 language at this stage (8.4 transfers should get separate
attention due to the tie-in with other RIRs). When I defended this proposal
in Montreal, I had may people come up to me after the session had ended who
expressed their support.
>
> I would ask that those of you who *do* think the time has come to shift
ARIN focus away from an inhibiting role, and instead prioritize accurate
documentation of IPv4 market-induced transfers, please speak up now. The
ARIN AC and membership needs to hear views of not only those opposed to this
proposal.
>
> ----
> Dani Roisman
>
>
> | -----Original Message-----
> | Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2016 00:12:54 +0000
> | From: Leif Sawyer <lsawyer at gci.com>
> | To: ARIN PPML <arin-ppml at arin.net>
> | Subject: [arin-ppml] Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9: Eliminating
> | needs-based evaluation for Section 8.2 and 8.3 transfers of IPv4
> | netblocks
> | Message-ID:
> | <EDF941B230F4C446826CF893A9C8CE59E0DBF413 at ex-mbx-
> | prd02.gci.com>
> | Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252
> |
> | Good afternoon -
> |
> | Based on feedback from Montreal as well as internal discussions,
> | I've reworked this policy.
> | AC members and ARIN staff are looking for additional feedback, as
> | well as your position in terms of supporting or opposing this draft
> | policy.
> |
> | We'll be discussing this policy, as well as any feedback provided
> | on this week's AC teleconference, so I'm very appreciative of your
> | input.
> |
> | Thanks,
> |
> | Leif Sawyer
> | Shepherd - ARIN-2015-9
> |
> | NRPM section 8: https://www.arin.net/policy/nrpm.html#eight
> |
> | Most current draft policy text follows:
> | --
> |
> | Draft Policy ARIN-2015-9
> | Eliminating needs-based evaluation for Section 8.2 and 8.3
> | transfers of IPv4 netblocks Original Date: 23 September 2015
> | Updated: 16 February, 2016
> |
> | Problem statement:
> | The current needs-based evaluation language in NRPM sections 8.2 and
> | 8.3, regarding transfer of IPv4 netblocks from one organization to
> | another, may cause a recipient organization to bypass the ARIN
> | registry entirely in order to secure the needed IPv4 netblocks in a
> | more timely fashion directly from the current holder. The result is
> | that the data visible in ARIN registry may become more inaccurate
> | over time.
> |
> | Policy statement:
> | This proposal eliminates all needs-based evaluation language for
> | sections 8.2 and 8.3, allowing transfers to be reflected in the
> | database as they occur following an agreement of transfer from the
> | resource provider to the recipient.
> |
> | Section 8.1 Principles:
> | - Strike the fragment from the 3rd paragraph which reads ", based on
> | justified need, "
> | so the resulting text reads
> | "Number resources are issued to organizations, not to individuals
> | representing those organizations."
> | Section 8.2 Mergers and Acquisitions:
> | - Change the 4th bullet from:
> | "The resources to be transferred will be subject to ARIN policies."
> | to:
> | "The resources to be transferred will be subject to ARIN policies,
> | excluding any policies related to needs-based justification."
> |
> | - Strike the final paragraph which begins "In the event that number
> | resources of the combined organizations are no longer justified under
ARIN policy ..."
> |
> | Section 8.3 Transfers between Specified Recipients within the ARIN
Region:
> | - Change the first bullet under "Conditions on recipient of the
transfer" from:
> | "The recipient must demonstrate the need for up to a 24-month supply
> | of IP address resources under current ARIN policies and sign an RSA."
> | to:
> | "The recipient must sign an RSA."
> |
> | - Change the 2nd bullet under "Conditions on recipient of the transfer"
from:
> | "The resources to be transferred will be subject to ARIN policies."
> | to:
> | "The resources to be transferred will be subject to ARIN policies,
> | excluding any policies related to needs-based justification."
> |
> | Comments:
> | a. Timetable for implementation: Immediate b. Anything else As the
> | "free pool" for 4 of the 5 world's RIR's (APNIC, RIPE, LACNIC, and
> | ARIN) have now been
> | exhausted, networks in need of additional IPv4 addresses have
> | shifted away from the practice of receiving them from the RIR's
> | resource pool. Instead, networks in need are seeking out current
> | holders of IPv4 resources who are willing to transfer them in order
> | to fulfill that need.
> | Accordingly, the RIR's
> | primary responsibility vis-?-vis IPv4 netblock governance has
> | shifted from "allocation" to ensuring an accurate registry database.
> |
> | The RIPE registry can be used as a reference of one which has
> | evolved over the past couple years to shift their focus away from
> | conservation/allocation and towards database accuracy. IPv4 netblock
> | transfers within that RIR consist merely of validating authenticity
> | of the parties requesting a transfer.
> | Provided the organizations meet the basic requirement of RIR
> | membership, and that the transferring organization has the valid
> | authority to request the transfer, the transaction completes without
> | any "needs-based" review.
> |
> |
> |
> _______________________________________________
> PPML
> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to the ARIN
> Public Policy Mailing List (ARIN-PPML at arin.net).
> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
> http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml
> Please contact info at arin.net if you experience any issues.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> PPML
> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to the ARIN
> Public Policy Mailing List (ARIN-PPML at arin.net).
> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
> http://lists.arin.net/mailman/listinfo/arin-ppml
> Please contact info at arin.net if you experience any issues.
--
Cheers,
McTim
"A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route
indicates how we get there." Jon Postel
------------------------------
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