[arin-ppml] Fwd: [ARIN-20140107-F1419] Fraud Report on CloudRadium LLC

Ted Mittelstaedt tedm at ipinc.net
Tue Oct 14 19:16:06 EDT 2014

On 10/14/2014 1:28 PM, Owen DeLong wrote:
> On Oct 13, 2014, at 19:31 , Adam Thompson<athompso at athompso.net>
> wrote:
>> Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer. The following represents my personal
>> opinions only at this time.
>>> From a Canadian standpoint, ARIN is extremely (ridiculously!)
>>> afraid of being sued in civil court.
>> They do have to operate in the USA, however, and that country is
>> well-known for being very litigious, so perhaps this aspect of
>> ARIN's behavior is justified.
> Or perhaps ARIN should relocate to Canada or another nation within
> the region which has a more suitable legal framework.
>> In any case, the end result is that what they need as "proof" of
>> fraud is MUCH more stringent than what you might expect. They
>> cannot assume you are being truthful in reporting this fraud,
>> whether you are or not. They also cannot assume you fully
>> understand what constitutes fraud, whether you do or not.
> Regardless of litigation implications, I think it is important for
> ARIN to exercise extreme caution in revoking resources in response to
> a fraud report. While I agree that they may be a little too cautious,
> I certainly don't want to see the other extreme where an
> unsubstantiated report can result in a revocation of number
> resources.

Please keep in mind, Owen, the poster was complaining about ARIN's
apparent LACK of investigation of his fraud report.  Extreme
caution is not the same thing as complete lack of progress of

You cannot make the claim that ARIN is just going slowly as a defense
against an accusation that ARIN isn't going at all.

We all want ARIN to exercise extreme caution in revoking resources
in response to a fraud report.

But, there's no justification in the universe for IGNORING a fraud 
report, which is what the poster is saying that ARIN is doing.

At the least, don't you think ARIN should have gotten back to the fraud
report submitter and confirmed receipt of the report, and asked some
questions to clarify aspects of the report?

We had a situation in my city, the story just broke as a matter of fact,
last week, about a group of tow truck drivers in cahoots with an
owner of several wrecking yards who were crushing stolen cars.  A city
employee was also involved.

This had been going on for the last 20 years or so.

The story broke a week AFTER the police chief announced his resignation.

The police department and DMV and other officials involved all tried
to pull that BS excuse that they had been investigating it all this
time.  But the paper that broke the story published addition info
showing that this was a big fat lie, they had only started an 
investigation a year ago.

I would guess more heads will roll on this besides the police chief.

If ARIN wants to play that game then we can look forward to ARIN
officials losing their jobs as well.

Just a little food for thought.


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