[arin-ppml] ARIN IPs and Spammers? => Need for Governance

Ted Mittelstaedt tedm at ipinc.net
Sat Nov 8 19:57:22 EST 2014

I for one would never support such a proposal.

I will point out the United States invented the Internet.  This is 
something that EVERY OTHER COUNTRY IN THE WORLD has to accept.  They
may not like to admit it even to themselves but they know it's true.

The United States modeled the Internet based on the "US publishing 
world" meaning that speech - ie: publishing - on the Internet is under 
First Amendment protection.  In short, there are no prohibitions on it.

That is why the very structure of the TCP/IP protocol itself does not
carry anything in it that helps to identify content, or make it easier
for people wanting to prohibit certain content.  This is why you cannot
run VoIP traffic over the Internet (without it sounding like a child's
Skype toy) because networks do not honor or pay attention to traffic
content - VoIP traffic is given the same priority as data traffic.

Other countries such as China which have totalitarian governments that 
do not have freedom of speech, had to accept the United State's 
definition of what the Internet is - that is, no prohibitions.  In order
to advance their filtering agendas they have had to "tack on" content
filters.  (ie: The Great Firewall)

And there are many more people in the world who would like to control
other people by denying or filtering content.  From the Ayatollas in
Iran to the dictators in China to the religious nutcases who still have
a lot of control in counties like Mexico, there is no shortage of people 
who would like to prohibit something on the Internet.

It would be a great evil for the RIR system to get involved in that. 
Once you opened the door to denying spammers, the small-brained 
retrogrades in the Vatican and other places that want to control speech 
and who currently don't understand the Internet, would realize that they
could accomplish their goals of bringing another Dark Ages on the world 
by interfering in the RIR system.

If you live in the United States - where free speech is required by law 
- would you trust that censor button in the hands of a typical 
Republican politician?  And those are people in the US who are required 
by law NOT to censor!!!

There is no parallel to financial trading or any of that.  And I will 
point out that financial contracts are violated ALL THE TIME by 
governments with impunity.

When the United States freezes bank accounts of an overseas government 
to protest something they break hundreds if not thousands of contracts. 
  And people get old and die waiting for their money.  The
arbitration system has no control over that sort of thing.  So to claim 
that the financial arbitration system is a model of how the RIR's could
implement something is absolutely ridiculous.


On 11/8/2014 11:53 AM, McTim wrote:
> On Sat, Nov 8, 2014 at 9:23 AM, John Von Stein
> <John at qxccommunications.com <mailto:John at qxccommunications.com>> wrote:
>     This does not need to be “eye for an eye” enforcement. ____
>     __ __
>     Just like a speeding, beyond the safety issues involved the
>     deterrent against doing it partially the cost of the fine and the
>     increased insurance premium but mostly is the fear of losing the
>     privilege, not the right, to drive.  Repeated or an egregious
>     offense will lead to someone’s driver’s license being revoked. ____
>     __ __
>     If we define the use of IP addresses as a privilege, not a right,
>     granted by ARIN then it is possible to build Acceptable Use rules on
>     that founding principle.
> Possible, yes, but is it desirable?
> So far no RIR policy community has gotten into the deeply murky issue of
> content regulation (which is what many would call it if we were to
> create an anti-spam policy).
> You are free to write such a policy and see if you can get agreement
> from the community.
> --
> Cheers,
> McTim
> "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A
> route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel
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