[arin-ppml] Regarding unauthorized changes (Re: Policy question)

George Herbert george.herbert at gmail.com
Thu Sep 20 16:34:25 EDT 2012

Jeffrey -

With all due respect; 3 issues.

1, This is not appropriate on-list.

2, Presumably, ARIN received evidence that the change was proper prior
to making it.  That evidence could have been wrong, forged,
fraudulent.  But a random person on the net asserting that a change is
wrong, forged, or fraudulent does not mean that it is wrong, forged,
or fraudulent.  If the process is that anyone can make an assertion
like that and the net is suspended, the possible damage is immense -
anyone could procedurally disrupt huge parts of the net by making
false claims of improper transfers.

You are not personally "random person on the net" and I assume you
haven't changed from an honorable networking professional to a malign
saboteur overnight, so I would guess you've got a good case here.  But
you're putting ARIN in the job of being a private detective and
judicial authority.  That's wrong.  They're a resources management
cooperative.  Them insisting that you convince a judge (who deals, by
profession, in wrongs, forgeries, and fraud) that something was wrong
with the other guy and it should be yours, is proper.

3, You said (I think) that you acquired these from a bankruptcy.  One
of the expected costs of acquiring assets that way is that sometimes
there are legal challenges.  If you aren't willing to deal with the
occasional legal challenge you should not procure assets that way.  If
your expectations were that that never happens, you were wrong in
those assumptions to start with, and need to reconsider your business


On Thu, Sep 20, 2012 at 8:04 AM, Jeffrey Lyon
<jeffrey.lyon at blacklotus.net> wrote:
> John,
> You did not become involved until after our records were illegally changed,
> so you're regarding the wrong POC as owner of these resources. We continue
> to route them, and the POC listed does not operate a network so they cannot
> legally hold these resources.
> Thanks, Jeff
> On Sep 20, 2012 11:01 AM, "John Curran" <jcurran at arin.net> wrote:
>> On Sep 20, 2012, at 10:50 AM, Jeffrey Lyon <jeffrey.lyon at blacklotus.net>
>> wrote:
>> John,
>> The unauthorized change preceded the failure of ARIN to assist in
>> reverting the errorneous record. You're protecting the wrong party.
>> Jeffrey -
>>    We've made to resource records from the authorized point-of-contact on
>> the address block
>>    each time.  Changes based  instead on interpretation of contested legal
>> documents requires
>>    some form of legal adjudication first.
>> Thank you,
>> /John
>> John Curran
>> President and CEO
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-george william herbert
george.herbert at gmail.com

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