[arin-ppml] IPV6, Not yet (OT)
Owen DeLong
owen at delong.com
Thu Apr 14 18:08:57 EDT 2011
>>
>>> It takes development time and dollars for any product, and adding in
>>> IPv6 support isn't any different. The manufacturer had to spend R&D
>>> dollars to add an IPv6 stack into the management card and so they are
>>> going to pass that cost to the consumer.
>>>
>> Yes, but, they've had a decade and then some to do that. Sorry, not
>> much sympathy here for the pathetic state of many vendor's products.
>> Other manufacturers have found their way there, so, obviously it is
>> possible. D-Link sells a whole range of $50 routers with IPv6 support.
>>
>
> I would have let your response stand until I came to that. What good is
> a router that supports IPv6 if it locks up all the time?
>
I know a number of people running DIR-625 and 685s that do not
have that problem.
> People praise D-link and some may say they are stable but I got a
> DIR-615 rev C at home that I bought brand new that says otherwise.
> It's been babied and I even still have the box for it but the
> radio locks up at random intervals and it did that right out of the
> box. Of course, I didn't figure out what it was doing until it was
> too late to return it to the store.
>
> I'll wait until I see some better quality coming out of that company
> before I send them anymore green.
>
That's your call. You're the first of about 50 people I've known with that
box to say it is unstable. I have many other criticisms of the DIR series,
but, I'm not aware of chronic stability problems.
As such, I'll stand by my statement that the possibility of a $50 residential
gateway with IPv6 support has been proven. (Even if you don't like
the D-Link, the AVM FritzBox also works).
>>
>> I wouldn't buy one today, but, 8 years ago when I bought that unit (it certainly
>> wasn't a stripped down low-cost model at $2,300 for a 34" television and it
>> was VERY heavy), it was a very high quality unit and the only available flat
>> panel technology was gas plasma which had serious reliability and lifetime
>> problems.
>>
>
> I'm not talking about 8 year old TVs. I am typing this on a glass CRT running 1800 x 1440 so I'm well aware of the capabilities of a CRT. But the high-end TV makers stopped using glass CRTs a while ago. I was talking about hi-def CRT's that you can walk into the discount store
> and buy today. You can see the lines on them from across the room.
>
Yeah, I've seen those. I haven't seen anyone buying them, but, I've seen them collecting
dust on the shelves in a couple of stores.
>>> I could see LG or other manufacturer producing a combination BlueRay/DVD/VCR/HD Tuner unit that only output in NTSC for use with an
>>> older TV set in the $39.95 range. It would sell like hotcakes to
>>> the blue-haired crowd who just need something for the grandkids
>>> to run their new-fangled disks on when they are over.
>>>
>> Why bother to include a BluRay (there really isn't an e in BluRay, dude)
>> reader? The blue-hair isn't going to pay the price-premium for the BluRay
>> discs.
>>
>
> Because within 3-5 years the motion picture association will not be
> releasing anything on DVD anymore. Partly due to the resolution but
> mainly because CSS was cracked years ago and you can rip a DVD to your
> hard disk, while with BluRay they still hold out hope that they will be
> able to some day release a BluRay encryption scheme that Slysoft won't be able to crack.
>
BluRay has already been cracked. I doubt they will be able to deprecate
DVD as fast as you think. I have enough BD players that I don't care if they
do, but, I don't think they can. For one thing, there are still a lot of laptops
being made with DVD drives and not BD drives.
>>>> Nobody would buy such a thing if they knew what they were buying.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Would they?
>>>
>> Nope.
>>
>>> What if someone came to you and said that we want you to build us a
>>> network that will be used for a big trade show that will have 300 ports
>>> of fast ethernet on it, and it will need to run IPv6 and be completely
>>> flat - and then after the show we are just going to pitch all the
>>> switches into the garbage so we want them as cheap as possible.
>>>
>> I have no problem finding cheap switches with IPv6 management in them.
>> The Juniper EX, Cisco 3700, Cisco 2900, and several other models work
>> just fine for that.
>>
>>> And, by the way, they continue, every dollar you save on network
>>> hardware we will contribute to ARIN's IPv6 education fund, so the
>>> cheaper the gear you get, the more money goes to ARIN.
>>>
>> Not a problem. Show me a 48 port switch cheaper than a used 2924XL
>> and I'll be surprised.
>>
>
> Show me a piece of Cisco gear on the used market that you DON'T have
> to spend time flashing to something more recent than code from the Dinosaur Age to be able to use. ;-)
>
What do I care that I spend 5 minutes flashing the device. For a 300 port
network, I grab a volunteer intern and show him how to do the first one.
He does the other 8 in half a day and I'm done.
Owen
> Ted
>
>> Owen
>>
>>>
>>> Ted
>>>
>>>>> Well the fact is that if you look at the LG product blogs you WILL find
>>>>> people doing just that. Fortunately, you find more people telling them to STFU because that is what they get for not doing their homework.
>>>>>
>>>> Sigh, yes, you can get all kinds of hostility in most consumer electronics
>>>> or software forums. It doesn't inform or assist in the discussion and I
>>>> wouldn't exactly hold it up as the shining example of useful public behavior.
>>>>
>>>> Owen
>>>>
>>>>> Ted
>>>>>
>>>>>> Owen
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Apr 14, 2011, at 3:00 PM, Ted Mittelstaedt<tedm at ipinc.net> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Well, here is a video of a Transition Networks guy
>>>>>>> saying at least one of their Ethernet switches is IPv6
>>>>>>> capable:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0tw_uJXv00
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Now in answer to your other question as to why people
>>>>>>> don't name names, it is because there is a saying among marketing folks:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "bad news is better than NO news"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I've also heard it expressed:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "good news is good, but bad news is also good!"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Think for a moment that this list is archived. So a web robot
>>>>>>> will be crawling the archive sooner or later and come across
>>>>>>> the vendor name. That will give the vendor a boost in the
>>>>>>> search engines. So by publicly naming the vendor, you
>>>>>>> probably help them as much as you harm them.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You should also keep in mind the old adage about sales
>>>>>>> and marketing people:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "When do you know when a marketing or sales person is lying?"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "When their lips are moving!" ;-)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ted
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 4/14/2011 10:13 AM, Aaron Wendel wrote:
>>>>>>>> I don't understand why people feel it necessary not to shame these
>>>>>>>> vendors in public. I would like to remove them from my list as well.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> /Sent via DROID on Verizon Wireless/
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original message-----
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *From: *Larry Ash<lar at mwtcorp.net>*
>>>>>>>> To: *arin-ppml at arin.net*
>>>>>>>> Sent: *Thu, Apr 14, 2011 16:31:25 GMT+00:00*
>>>>>>>> Subject: *[arin-ppml] IPV6, Not yet (OT)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sorry for the distraction,
>>>>>>>> I send this along only to remind those of us that maintain IPV4 will
>>>>>>>> die shortly,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Before purchasing switching equipment for the customer edge on a
>>>>>>>> metro-ethernet
>>>>>>>> deployment I questioned the manufacturer about IPV6 and here was the
>>>>>>>> reply.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>> The information I received from the Product Management team is that
>>>>>>>> IPV6 is
>>>>>>>> not on the road map for this product at this time. If you need any other
>>>>>>>> assistance please contact us.
>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------
>>>>>>>> This is a fairly new product that has a lot of sexy features many of
>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>> rely on layer3 yet the manufacturer is not even planning IPV6. I did
>>>>>>>> inform
>>>>>>>> them that I am removing them from any consideration for any of their
>>>>>>>> products.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The word is still not getting to management in a meaningful way.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Larry Ash
>>>>>>>> Network Administrator
>>>>>>>> Mountain West Telephone
>>>>>>>> 123 W 1st St.
>>>>>>>> Casper, WY 82601
>>>>>>>> Office 307 233-8387
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> PPML
>>>>>>>> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
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>>>>>>>> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
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>>>>>>>> Please contact info at arin.net if you experience any issues.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> PPML
>>>>>>>> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
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>>>>>>>> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
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>>>>>>>> Please contact info at arin.net if you experience any issues.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> PPML
>>>>>>> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to
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>>>>>>> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
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>>>>>>> Please contact info at arin.net if you experience any issues.
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>
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