[arin-ppml] ARIN releases new version of the Legacy Registration

Cliff Bedore cliffb at cjbsys.bdb.com
Tue Sep 9 11:55:11 EDT 2008

Howard, W. Lee wrote:
> Sorry, the length of this message kind of got away from me.  I'm
> trying to put many thoughts into a single message, rather than
> spew messages into PPML all day.
...... stuff deleted

> Let's talk about what we agree on.  While not universal, there's
> rough consensus around these points:
> * Legacy holders have a slightly different status than modern 
> holders

I'd delete slightly

> * ARIN is the organization providing rDNS, WHOIS, and other
> services that are useful to the community, in this region


> * Legacy holders should pay some nominal maintenance fee, to pay
> for maintenance of those services, and as an annual check that 
> the legacy holder still exists and is using the numbers

Legacy holders "are willing to pay".  It appears from other posts that 
ARIN doesn't really need the money so the contact information seems to 
be the big issues.

> * Legacy holders who are using the space should not have to 
> give up the space (unless required by a force greater than 
> community consensus).  Conversely, legacy holders who are not
> using the space should make that space available for 
> reassignment; those with partial utilization should be 
> encouraged, but not forced, to release what they can.
Legacy holders who are not using... "should".  So those who have no
agreement only "should" make the space available but those who sign the
LRSA and then decide to terminate the contract for convenience will lose
that space.  It seems that LRSA signers are being put at a disadvantage
compared to non-signers

> * ARIN must abide by laws, government regulations, court 
> rulings, and contracts.
> * People and organizations holding address space must abide by
> laws, government regulations, court rulings and contracts.
> Right?
> Under the new LRSA, the contract would be terminated, but the 
> resources would remain with the legacy holder, under the 
> following circumstances:
> 1. 14(c) the legacy holder terminates for cause, or 
> 2. 15(k) ARIN is unable to provide service due to force majeure.
> Fair so far?

Per above, I don't agree with 14(c) being limited to terminates for cause.

> The only major point of contention is whether a legacy holder
> should ever be required to release their resources to ARIN.  As
> I read the LRSA, the contract would be terminated and ARIN
> would stop providing service (i.e., revoke) under the following 
> circumstances:
> 1.  4(c) Legacy holder does not provide "information, assistance,
> and cooperation that ARIN requests in provision of the Services."
> ARIN may simply refuse additional resources instead.
> 2.  4(d)(i) Legacy holder disrupts or interferes with ARIN's 
> services, 
> 3. 4(d)(ii) Legacy holder "violate(s) any applicable laws, 
> statutes or regulations, as established by a definitive ruling 
> of a court or government agency;"
> 4. 4(d)(iii) Legacy holder "assist(s) any third party in engaging 
> in any activity prohibited by this Legacy Agreement."
> 5.  6(b)(ii) Legacy holder falls more than a year overdue on 
> maintenance fees (which are substantially capped).  ARIN may stop
> providing Services without revocation, and in any case must allow
> an additional year for the holder to make good before reassigning
> the numbers.
> 6. 5(a) - (c) Legacy holder misuses ARIN's database
> 7.  14(b)(ii) Breach of contract that remains uncured for 30 days
> 8.  14(a) Legacy holder decides to terminate the contract for 
> convenience.  Note that ARIN cannot terminate for convenience in

I would agree that ARIN could stop providing services but I'm not
convinced they should be able to revoke the numbers

> LRSA 2.0.
> Please let me know if I've missed or mistated any scenarios; it's 
> entirely possible and not intentional.  I'm just reading along 
> like everyone else.

I'm not trying to be too picky but "silence gives consent" and I'm not
consenting yet.  Repeating my comments of earlier, if ARIN is trying to
formalize relationships with legacy holders, it can be done in a much
less restrictive manner than the current LRSA.  If they're trying to
recover unused/lost address space, there is no need for the LRSA since
per above, people who have it will only be encouraged to return it and
those who have disappeared from the grid and don't answer any requests
from ARIN will obviously not have any agreement with ARIN.  It seems odd
that the people who are most willing to participate face the most
onerous sanctions.


> Now, I understand that some people believe they have an
> inviolable right to maintain their resources under all 
> circumstances.  I believe that if a legacy holder violates the
> trust of the community, the community ought to have recourse.
> The community founded ARIN, to operate the registry and reverse
> DNS, and to facilitate community development of policies for
> stewardship of numbers, and to do what is needed to support 
> that mission.  It seems to me that the termination clauses are 
> trying to protect ARIN's ability to serve the community and 
> fulfill its mission.
> I think ARIN has come pretty far with this new LRSA, trying to
> protect both legacy holders and the rest of the community.  I 
> appreciate the participation on this list by so many people 
> responsible for legacy address space, when many of the 
> policies developed will not ultimately affect you.  I 
> acknowledge the concession many of you have made, in 
> willingness to support ARIN financially.  I respect the 
> contributions legacy holders have made to the development and growth of
> the Internet.  I hope you can see the Legacy RSA, 
> which was designed to offer greater assurance to the legacy
> holder than the conventional RSA, as a tool for protecting the 
> community's broader interest.
> I must be clear, that I do not represent ARIN any more than 
> any other community member when it comes to the LRSA.  I hope
> that everyone with questions about the LRSA will call the 
> Registration Services Help Desk at +1.703.227. 0660 or send 
> email to hostmaster at arin.net, or with specific legal questions, 
> contact ARIN General Counsel, Steve Ryan, at sryan at mwe.com. 
> Lee
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