[arin-ppml] Policy Proposal 2008-6

[Kevin Kargel]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net [mailto:arin-ppml-bounces at arin.net] On
> Behalf Of Leo Bicknell
> Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2008 8:26 AM
> To: arin-ppml at arin.net
> Subject: Re: [arin-ppml] Policy Proposal 2008-6
> 
> In a message written on Tue, Dec 30, 2008 at 09:38:56PM -0500, Brent
> Sweeny wrote:
> > the trick is not to wave our arms vainly against the wind, insisting on
> a
> > view of the internet in our region that's just not realistic--either too
> > wild-west *or* too regulated.  I *believe* that what Randy is saying is
> that
> > there's already a flourishing black market and that it's likely vain to
> think
> > we can stop it by fiat *or* by trying to jigger the financials--it's
> assumed
> > to be too well-entrenched and too adaptable.  How large that market is
> may be
> > both crucial and impossible to know, but it's foolish to pretend it
> isn't
> > there, or is insignificant enough that rules alone might make it go
> away. And
> 
> Here's the problem I have had with that argument from the start,
> it's not self-consistent.
> 
> The argument is that:
> 
>   1) The black market is large enough, and powerful enough that we can't
>      control it in any meaningful way.
> 
>   2) The black market operates totally in the shadows, hidden from view,
>      and can't be measured.
> 
> It just doesn't make sense.  If 50% of the IP space out there was
> traded by the black market we'd have people coming out of the
> woodwork talking about the deals they made.  Even if all of these
> people managed to keep silent, we could measure by subtraction,
> half the space ISP's were asked to route would look "fishy" with
> wrong names, addresses, etc in whois.

I have often wondered about this "black market" myself..  everyone talks
about it, but in 15+ years of working in Internet I have never been
approached and offered IP addresses for sale.  I have never seen anyone
offer them, and searching even on newsgroups and other forums I have not
seen offers of network for money.  I have seen netblocks hijacked, but not
illicitly sold.  I believe it has happened, but I do not think the frequency
of it happening is quite the problem it is touted to be.

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