[ppml] Revision to 2008-3
josh at acornactivemedia.com
Wed Apr 2 02:08:45 EDT 2008
David Farmer wrote:
> On 2 Apr 2008 Owen DeLong wrote:
>> I absolutely think that it is vital to be more specific for this policy.
> I have no problem being specific. I have a problem thinking that you are
> being specific by referencing sections of US Tax Code. First, its not valid
> outside the US. Second, it make ARIN policy changeable by the US
> Congress, probably a bad idea on multiple fronts. Referencing a 501(c)3
> organization as an example of an organization that would likely meet the
> requirements is probably acceptable.
>> Here's a stab at a statement that describes what I feel should be
>> To qualify as a community network under ARIN policy, the network must
>> be owned and operated by an organization which is organized and/or
>> chartered as a not-for-profit which is engaged in providing the service
>> to the benefit of the local community at large and not limited to any
>> subclass of the community by religion, union membership, pension
>> status, or any other form of membership requirement other than if
>> such membership is open to all members of the community with
>> equal voting status and control of the organization at a cost
>> which would not reasonably be considered prohibitive to any person
>> living above the locally defined poverty level.
>> This probably needs a lot of work, but, it's the best I could do without
>> copying the tax code and I'm not willing to do that at 3:15 AM (which
>> is the local time here at the moment).
> I like what I see, no references to US Tax Code and personally I don't think I
> can complain about the specifics, however I do have a question and some
> scenarios for you to think about;
> So you are saying that a Community Network must be incorporated for that
> purpose? Or could other non-profit organizations incubate a Community
> Network and then spin it out as a separate organization at a future date, or
> run it for ever as a D.B.A (Doing Business As).
> I was thinking that maybe some other community based organization should
> be allowed to sponsor a Community Network and act as the legal entity that
> can sign contracts on it behalf, with ARIN, etc... I know several Universities
> and other organizations that are doing this or that have done this kind of
> thing in the past. In fact much of the early Internet worked this way.
> A hypothetical example; let's say the Minneapolis Chamber of Commerce,
> wanted to sponsor the creation of a Minneapolis Community Network, and
> basically started it as a D.B.A, community members run it, CoC is simply
> acting as the legal shell for doing business. And for sake of discussion lets
> say the CoC is organized as a 501(c)6, I have no idea if this is the case or
> not the Minneapolis Chamber of Commerce might be a 501(c)3 for all I
> Another hypothetical example; let's say the University of Minnesota wanted
> to sponsor the creation of a Minneapolis Community Network, and basically
> started it as a D.B.A, community members run it, UMN is simply acting as
> the legal shell for doing business. And for discussion UMN is not a 501(c)3,
> it is a Constitutional Corporation of the State of Minnesota, making it a
> political sub-division of state government, in this case I know this to be a
> Just to be clear these are completely hypothetical, at least as far as I know,
> Minneapolis has a Public/Private partnership delivering community WIFI
> service already. And it is function as a LIR I believe, and not really the type
> of thing this policy is intended for.
In fact most of the community networks that I've encountered have
existed as something other than a fully incorporated 501(c)3. Many are
working groups of larger organizations or are fiscally sponsored by
them. I have no problem with the idea that they should be
not-for-profit, but I agree that a degree of flexibility is in order.
>> On Apr 1, 2008, at 11:38 PM, David Farmer wrote:
>>> I will add that 501(c)3 is only one, the most general and common,
>>> form of a
>>> non-profit organization recognized by USIRC, several other 501(c)
>>> organizations could legitimately sponsor a Community Network,
>>> including a
>>> 501(c)6 Chamber of Commerce, 501(c)7 Recreational club, just to name a
>>> few other possibilities.
>>> Further, I could easily see a city or other political sub-division
>>> of government
>>> sponsoring a Community Network too, and they are not covered by
>>> 501(c) at
>>> all. So even if you are only dealing with the US, I think
>>> specifying 501(c)3
>>> would not be a good idea. Then if you bring in other countries you
>>> can't be more specific than non-profit or not-for-profit.
>>> On 1 Apr 2008 Ray Plzak wrote:
>>>> An observation. The ARIN region consists of more countries than the
>>>> US, hence citing sections of the US tax code is probably not a good
>>>> thing to do. I see that you have included the phrase "or local
>>>> equivalent" but that is not necessarily clear. Perhaps, simply
>>>> not for profit would be sufficient.
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: ppml-bounces at arin.net [mailto:ppml-bounces at arin.net] On
>>>>> Behalf Of
>>>>> Owen DeLong
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 01, 2008 12:36 AM
>>>>> + IRS 501(c)3 or local equivalent not for profit status
>>>>> should not qualify in my opinion).
>>> David Farmer Email: farmer at umn.edu
>>> Office of Information Technology
>>> University of Minnesota Phone: 612-626-0815
>>> 2218 University Ave SE Cell: 612-812-9952
>>> Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029 FAX: 612-626-1818
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> David Farmer Email: farmer at umn.edu
> Office of Information Technology
> University of Minnesota Phone: 612-626-0815
> 2218 University Ave SE Cell: 612-812-9952
> Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029 FAX: 612-626-1818
> You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to the ARIN Public Policy
> Mailing List (PPML at arin.net).
> Unsubscribe or manage your mailing list subscription at:
> Please contact the ARIN Member Services Help Desk at info at arin.net if you experience any issues.
josh at acornactivemedia.com
Senior Network Engineer, Acorn Active Media
System Administrator, Chambana.net (http://www.chambana.net)
"I am an Anarchist not because I believe Anarchism is the final goal,
but because there is no such thing as a final goal." -Rudolf Rocker
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