[ppml] Keeping the story straight
JORDI PALET MARTINEZ
jordi.palet at consulintel.es
Sun Jun 3 04:17:47 EDT 2007
That's why it is needed ULA-Central, in the sense of a prefix that
*requires* registration in a central registry, so never there is a clash. If
a company uses ULA-Central w/o going to the registry, in case of a clash
that company will be in trouble because did the wrong thing.
Having a volunteer registry service for ULA doesn't mandate everyone to
register, and thus, nobody is doing wrong: it creates the wrong impression
that you're safe, but not really, because it is not part of the "protocol".
> De: John Santos <JOHN at egh.com>
> Responder a: <JOHN at egh.com>
> Fecha: Sat, 2 Jun 2007 22:50:45 -0400
> Para: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ <jordi.palet at consulintel.es>
> CC: <ppml at arin.net>
> Asunto: Re: [ppml] Keeping the story straight
> On Sun, 3 Jun 2007, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ wrote:
>> Hi Jeroen,
>> Is nothing personal. I can trust you, many people can trust many volunteer
>> services, but for something that big enterprises need to have the security
>> of a 0% collision chances, they will not trust a volunteer service. There is
>> NO warrantee for them that this will keep running forever.
> I don't see why it is necessary that it run forever. If enterprise A
> and Enterprise B and Enterprise C all register unique addresses with
> SixXS' server, SixXS could vanish into the great bit bucket 5
> seconds later, and there would still never be a collision between A,
> B or C.
> If Enterprises D and E created their own ULA addresses and did not register
> with SixXS, then there is no guarantee there won't be a collision between
> D and A, B, C or E, or between E and A, B, C or D, whether or not SixXS
> continues to exist. The only difference if SixXS goes away and A wants
> to interconnect with D or E, they will have to use other means to verify
> uniqueness (like ask each other what addresses they are using.) This is
> exactly the current state of affairs without SixXS. For as long as SixXS
> continues to exist, D and E would have the option of registering with it,
> and ensuring uniqueness (but possibly having to renumber if they have
> already used colliding ULAs.) If SixXS goes away, they would no longer
> have this option, but this could not suddenly cause A, B or C to collide
> with each other.
> Neither Enterprise A nor B nor C needs any promise that SixXS will continue
> to exist after they register with it to know they are still unique
> within the set of SixXS' registerees. (Unless of course they want to
> register *additional* ULA space, which puts them in the same position
> as D & E with respect to the new space but doesn't affect the existing
>> Is nothing related to you work, is just the way enterprises work.
>> Is nothing related to you offering this service, it can be another volunteer
>> team, it will be the same.
>>> De: Jeroen Massar <jeroen at unfix.org>
>>> Organización: Unfix
>>> Responder a: <jeroen at unfix.org>
>>> Fecha: Sat, 02 Jun 2007 21:02:26 +0100
>>> Para: <jordi.palet at consulintel.es>
>>> CC: <ppml at arin.net>
>>> Asunto: Re: [ppml] Keeping the story straight
>>> JORDI PALET MARTINEZ wrote:
>>>> Unfortunately volunteers offering a service can't be trusted by
>>>> organizations, as the service can vanish and then you're in trouble.
>>> Ehmm. Hold on there for a few seconds. That subject really doesn't
>>> match the content, but lets make it match quite a bit more.
>>> Are you implying that SixXS can't be trusted!? I am really wondering
>>> what you are trying to imply with that statement.
>>> Did you notice that http://www.sixxs.net/tools/grh/ula/ contains a
>>> list of all the allocations that have been made? (inet6num.txt)
>>> Do you realize that that list is VERY easy to mirror.
>>> Do you realize that that list is nicely mirrored into Google and
>>> various other crawler bots who crawl the web?
>>> Claiming that it can 'vanish' is just pathetic. SixXS won't 'vanish',
>>> there are too many people very happily using the services that it
>>> provides, and actually we are more than enjoying ourselves in
>>> providing the various great services that it provides to the
>>> community. Neither Pim or I have any intentions of letting the project
>>> vanish. As long as people have a need for free help in getting IPv6
>>> going in their organizations we are ready to assist them with the help
>>> and experience that we can provide them.
>>> I've also stated, but I'll do it again, that if/when one of the
>>> RIR/IETF/IANA has a registry for these things that we can provide them
>>> with the current list, and redirect the page to that resource.
>>> Those are the 'authoritive' places, and we play in that game.
>>> Next to that, you are definitely mixing up ULA-C with normal ULA's.
>>> Normal ULA's, according to RFC4193 don't have any registered part.
>>> ULA-C's are not accepted by the registry we run, which is not so
>>> strange as there is no RFC covering fc00::/8. The ULA registry that
>>> currently is at http://www.sixxs.net/tools/grh/ula/ allows people
>>> merely to register their ULA's so that it might decrease the chance of
>>> collisions a little bit more.
>>>> Sorry, but this ULA-Central need a serious proven and stable service
>>> And are you implying here that SixXS is not a proven and not stable
>>> I do sincerely hope that you are not trying to insult all the hard
>>> work that has gone and more that will go into into this project by a
>>> lot of people and several great companies that have been supporting
>>> this project for the last couple of years. I feel _very_ insulted by
>>> the statements you are making here and I really hope that you are
>>> meaning something completely different.
>>> What are you going to claim next, that Team Cymru, who also are doing
>>> great work, should not maintain bogon lists because they are not a
>>>> and the RIRs are already doing so for other kinds of addresses.They are the
>>>> perfect fit, and the alternative is IANA or a third party organization.
>>> How is SixXS not a "third party organization"?
>>>> Of course, if the community prefers going that way and have a third party
>>>> organizations running that registry, I'm fine and all will pay the
>>>> consequences sooner or later.
>>> Sorry, but all of this coming from someone who is abusing his
>>> "Experimental IPv6 Allocation", thus avoiding paying of LIR fees, so
>>> that it can be used to do an "Experimental IPv6 ISP Service" as you
>>> described it last week on these lists, sounds really really bad.
>> The IPv6 Portal: http://www.ipv6tf.org
>> Bye 6Bone. Hi, IPv6 !
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> John Santos
> Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc.
> 781-861-0670 ext 539
The IPv6 Portal: http://www.ipv6tf.org
Bye 6Bone. Hi, IPv6 !
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