[ppml] Summary of Trial Balloons for Dealing withIPv4AddressCountdown

Davis, Terry L terry.l.davis at boeing.com
Mon Apr 2 22:56:01 EDT 2007



I agree with you.  There has to be a policy for at least critical
infrastructure if nothing else.


The aviation industry especially is going to be stuck dealing with both
aircraft and ground infrastructures (you can't force nations or business
to change their stack to suite someone else) that are mixed; existing
OSI based ATC, just entering IPv4 Airbus 380 and Boeing 787, and our
future aircraft that will be IPv6; we probably have somewhere between 20
and 30 years of living in this mixed environment.


The ISP's may want to stop handling legacy v4 traffic at some point; but
I think government may weigh in here at some point (sure it may cost
us..) too.

Take care 


From: Azinger, Marla [mailto:marla.azinger at frontiercorp.com] 
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 7:47 AM
To: Ted Mittelstaedt; Jim Weyand; ppml at arin.net
Subject: Re: [ppml] Summary of Trial Balloons for Dealing


I strongly disagree

	-----Original Message-----
	From: Ted Mittelstaedt [mailto:tedm at ipinc.net]
	Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 8:23 PM
	To: Azinger, Marla; Jim Weyand; ppml at arin.net
	Subject: RE: [ppml] Summary of Trial Balloons for Dealing with

	Marla,  the evolution thing is already listed, it is item #2


	As for reserve space, that would only be relevant if the
Internet were to not ever switch

	over to IPv6.  Once we hit the 80-90th percentile of sites on
the Internet reachable via

	IPv6, your going to see a lot of people beginning to block out
ALL IPv4 route advertisements

	merely to save space in their routing tables.


	I do not see how on an Internet that is IPv6, that you could
have any support for

	a legacy block of routed IPv4.  It would become a ghetto that
would be used

	by spammers and all manner of criminals to launch network
attacks.  No, the

	sites that feel they cannot switch over to IPv6 will simply have
to disconnect

	once most of the rest of the world is IPv6.


	Personally I might not mind drivng a car in the US that has a
150 inch width but

	the rest of the world isn't going to widen it's roads for me.
Thus it will be for the

	sites that want to stay IPv4 forever.




	 -----Original Message-----
	From: ppml-bounces at arin.net [mailto:ppml-bounces at arin.net]On
Behalf Of Azinger, Marla
	Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 3:22 PM
	To: Jim Weyand; ppml at arin.net
	Subject: Re: [ppml] Summary of Trial Balloons for Dealing with

		Jim-  Thank you for taking time on this issue and trying
to organize the thoughts a bit.


		Right now I view alot of the sujbect matter that makes
up this issue as being resolved by evolution.   That said there is one
thing on your list below that we could write policy for and one thing
that is not on your list that needs to be discussed and possibly policy
written for.


		The one thing that you dont have below that I think does
need to be answered by our community is...should we have a reserve of
IPv4 space?  If yes, who/what would qualify for the reserved address
space?  Are there truely entities that will never be able to transition
to IPv4?  Who can do the research to create a list of valid


		The item on your list below that could use policy is
Recycling IPv4 addresses after we have ran out.  How is the RIR to
handle this?  Do they put them on a wait list?  Is the wait list first
come first serve?  Is it prioritized somehow?  Or if we voted to have a
reserve are the returned IPv4 addresses added to the reserve and all
that dont qualify under reserve standards are told switch to IPv6?


		Ok.  That is my two cents.

		Thank you for your time

		Marla Azinger

		Frontier Communications

		[Azinger, Marla] 

		 -----Original Message-----
		From: ppml-bounces at arin.net
[mailto:ppml-bounces at arin.net]On Behalf Of Jim Weyand
		Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:35 PM
		To: ppml at arin.net
		Subject: [ppml] Summary of Trial Balloons for Dealing
with IPv4 AddressCountdown

			It seems like it is time to start the relatively
hard work of actually developing alternative policy proposals to deal
with the IPv4 Address Exhaustion Issue.  It is too late to prepare
proposals for the April meeting but we have about 5 months before the
cutoff for the October meeting.  I have never written a proposal to any
of the governing bodies but my guess it will take at least that long to:
gather a group of like-minded individuals; negotiate the details of what
to propose; write the proposal; seek feedback; rewrite the proposal;
etc, etc until the proposal is either accepted or made irrelevant by
another proposal.


			I find myself struggling with how to convert the
suggestions and comments on this list into actual policy proposals.


			I think it is useful at this point to list the
different trial balloons and proposals that have been suggested and
discussed regarding IPv4 address exhaustion.  If you have a favorite
that I have missed, send it to me privately and I will send out a
revised summary in a week or so.


			1)       Policy Proposal 2007-12: IPv4 Countdown
Policy Proposal - I believe this is the only proposal that can be voted
on at the upcoming meeting in April.  The full text can be found at:
http://www.arin.net/policy/proposals/2007_12.html.  This proposal will,
"Set the date for termination of (IPv4) allocations and the date of
announcement".  This proposal specifically does not address IP address
recycling except to say that, "Recovery of unused address space should
be discussed separately."

			2)       An informal proposal to not make any
changes to current policy until absolutely necessary

			3)       An informal proposal to encourage
address recycling by increasing ARIN dues 

			4)       Several similar informal proposals to
encourage recycling by empowering ARIN to more actively police the use
of IPv4 addresses by various means

			5)       An informal proposal to change the
nature of assigned IPv4 addresses to something similar to real property

			6)       An informal proposal to ask holders of
unused address IPv4 addresses to voluntarily return the addresses

			7)       Several variants of informal proposals
to start assigning IPv6 space with IPv4

			8)       An informal proposal to get endusers to
demand access to IPv6 networks by creating a media storm similar to Y2K.


			It is time to make up your mind, roll up your
sleeves and get to work.  The current policies for dealing with IPv4
Addresses are not causing a crisis... yet.  It is however an urgent
issue and extremely important.

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