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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>Jesse,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>I believe you have now fully shed any guise of good faith in these discussions. Insisting that people who don’t agree with you are dense and slow-witted is not remotely helpful or acceptable in the community.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>mw<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> arin-discuss-bounces@arin.net [mailto:arin-discuss-bounces@arin.net] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Jesse D. Geddis<br><b>Sent:</b> April 16, 2013 12:10 PM<br><b>To:</b> Lee Howard<br><b>Cc:</b> arin-discuss@arin.net<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [arin-discuss] IPv6 as justification for IPv4?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Lee,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I fully realise one of the pitfalls of using an example where some in the audience are obtuse is that those individuals will spend all the time focusing on the tangential instead of the actual point.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Thank you for doing that. Now can we get back to the actual topic?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I look at these token ipv6 launch day "statistics" you're referencing as the marketing manure they are. Telus shovelled the same crap on both world launch days but they haven't delivered it to their users.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>2% usage in 15 years by best estimates anyone's given on this list is a friggin joke. Stop lying to yourselves. <br><br>Jesse Geddis <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>LA Broadband LLC<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>On Apr 16, 2013, at 12:00 PM, "Lee Howard" <<a href="mailto:spiffnolee@yahoo.com">spiffnolee@yahoo.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='background:white'><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:3.75pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><span style='color:black'><hr size=1 width="100%" align=center></span></div><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> Jesse D. Geddis <<a href="mailto:jesse@la-broadband.com">jesse@la-broadband.com</a>><br><b>To:</b> Mike A. Salim <<a href="mailto:msalim@localweb.com">msalim@localweb.com</a>> <br><b>Cc:</b> "<a href="mailto:arin-discuss@arin.net">arin-discuss@arin.net</a>" <<a href="mailto:arin-discuss@arin.net">arin-discuss@arin.net</a>> <br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, April 16, 2013 12:58 PM<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [arin-discuss] IPv6 as justification for IPv4?</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='color:black'><br>The vast majority of the people on this list subsidise those 73 orgs in x-large by encouraging policies and fees put yourself on weaker footing. Maybe some of you don't understand the sheer scale you are kneecapping yourselves at. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></blockquote><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='color:black'>Or maybe they do understand, and simply disagree with you. <br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:3.75pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='color:black'>AT&T has Well over 32 million friggin IPs. Does anyone on this list honestly believe att has done a stellar job on IPv6? <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></blockquote><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='color:black'>Yes, absolutely stellar. According to <a href="http://www.worldipv6launch.org/measurements/">http://www.worldipv6launch.org/measurements/</a> they have 8.26% of users reaching IPv6-enabled web sites over IPv6. They have more IPv6 users than anyone else in the world. I seem to recall that they have 34 million Internet customers, so they have at least 2.8 million IPv6 customers. In practice, it may be more like 25-30% of their users have IPv6, but it isn't being used because of Apple's Happy Eyeballs implementation, possibly in combination with 6rd, or content providers' slow IPv6 networks.<br><br>If you meet someone from AT&T, you should shake their hand and congratulate them on their IPv6 rollout, and thank them for leading the way.<br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:3.75pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='color:black'><br>Or with IPv4 for that matter? They are paying _at_most_ $0.0005 an IP address while someone in small is paying $0.61 an IP. Are you friggin joking me?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></blockquote><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='color:black'>I see that you are getting upset. That will not make your argument more convincing.<br>It sounds as if you are convinced that per-address pricing is the only fair way to set fees. That does not seem to be the consensus.<br><br>Lee<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></body></html>