[ARIN-consult] [arin-announce] Fee Schedule Change Consultation

Owen DeLong owen at delong.com
Wed Nov 14 11:30:07 EST 2012

On Nov 14, 2012, at 07:52 , Brian Johnson <bjohnson at drtel.com> wrote:

> Owen,
> I'm not sure what you really expect to happen here. Do we give away services to everyone so that they are the same as legacy holders... that doesn't work. Do we start charging legacy holders for their resources without an agreement from them... I can feel the lawyers prepping papers right now.

Several options...

1.	Discontinue services to legacy holders that don't start paying.
2.	Treat LRSA Signatories as a group that isn't subjected to the new fees.

> I will note that my understanding is that legacy holders will need to sign some kind of (L)RSA to get v6 space. They will then need to justify their assignment (at least the IPv6 assignment) to get space. Possibly they would have to "back justify" their legacy space? Maybe this is a way we can limp along with V4 longer?

As an example, a legacy holder with a /23 and a /24 of legacy IPv4 space and an ASN issued prior to ARIN formation pays $0.
If that legacy holder signs the LRSA, they start paying $100/year. If they don't, they continue to pay $0.

If they get IPv6 space, then, they have to sign the RSA for their IPv6 space and pay $100/year for that, but they are not required to sign the LRSA or RSA with regards to their IPv4 space. Under the current fee structure, they would pay $100/year whether or not they sign the LRSA for their IPv4 space.

Under the proposed fee structure, beginning with their 2013 billing, the one that did not sign the LRSA still pays $100/year only for their IPv6 space and continues to pay $0 for everything else. The one that chose to participate in the ARIN process and sign the LRSA, OTOH, receives a bill not for $0, not for $100, but for $400/year.

Now, there is a small exception to this... If that LRSA signature occurred early enough, they may only get charged either $125 or $225, depending on how one interprets the combination of RSA terms and LRSA terms with the proposed fee structure in 2013, with that fee continuing to go up $25/year each year until it reaches the $400/year in either 7 or 11 years, depending on how ARIN determines the starting point.

> I think that I would like ARIN to avoid legal issues when possible. I'm not sure if ARIN counsel would want to chime in on sending bills to legacy space holders who have not signed an agreement with ARIN. This may help me in my processing of this topic.

I would like ARIN to avoid legal issues too.

However, I also would like to avoid getting shafted in exchange for trying to be an upstanding member of the community.


> - Brian J.
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: arin-consult-bounces at arin.net [mailto:arin-consult-
>> bounces at arin.net] On Behalf Of Owen DeLong
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2012 9:19 AM
>> To: John Curran
>> Cc: arin-consult at arin.net
>> Subject: Re: [ARIN-consult] [arin-announce] Fee Schedule Change
>> Consultation
>> On Nov 13, 2012, at 19:48 , John Curran <jcurran at arin.net> wrote:
>>> On Nov 13, 2012, at 8:31 PM, Jimmy Hess <mysidia at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> The Fee schedule the consultation is about doesn't say legacy holders
>>>> are not included -- so it's not a fee schedule question.
>>> Agreed.
>>> To be clear, the proposed fee schedule has legacy address holders (who
>>> have opted to enter an LRSA with ARIN) paying the same fees as end-
>> users.
>>> Some earlier versions of the LRSA cap any increase in fees to $25/year,
>>> and for those cases the fees billed will increase by $25 each year until
>>> fee billed matches an end-user with the same quantity of number
>> resources.
>> Right... As proposed, those of us that agreed to get with the program will be
>> unfairly penalized vs. those who have chosen to continue to opt out of the
>> ARIN process.
>>> ARIN has consistently provided basic registry services for all resource
>>> holders in the region, including legacy address block holders without
>>> charge, and the proposed revision to the fee schedule would not not alter
>>> this practice.
>> Exactly... If you continued to ignore ARIN, you continue to get a free ride, but
>> if you opted in based, in part, on the theory that your ARIN fees would not
>> be unreasonably or rapidly increased, now you get shafted (if the current
>> proposal is implemented).
>> Owen
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