[arin-discuss] Justifiable Censorship?

Jon,

Do we all have to work through our lawyers or is it okay to think on our
own?  I think, if you read the context of what I wrote, I DO understand
that ARIN has the right to censor Dean's discussion.  I was simply
questioning whether or not he really violated the AUP and suggested that
maybe we should follow premise that was set forth by the Constitution.  

Is it okay that I ask that question or do we need to waste more of our
money by wasting lawyer time?  I "thought", since I was an ARIN member,
that I could voice my opinion.  Is this incorrect?

Kyle Ackerman
Founder
Xtratyme Technologies, Inc.
"Home of the Blueprint America Program"
www.xtratyme.com
888.987.2896 (888-XTRATYME)
 
"We develop partnerships with individuals, groups, businesses, and
governmental units that understand the importance of bringing good
quality high-speed Internet access to everyone in their local community"

-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Radel [mailto:jradel at vantage.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 12:18 PM
To: Kyle Ackerman
Subject: Re: [arin-discuss] Justifiable Censorship?


I suggest you consult with *your* lawyer and get an explanation of what
the 1st amendment actually means.  Or are you under the impression that
ARIN is a governmental body?

Jon Radel
Senior Director of Engineering
Vantage Communications
p: 267-756-1014
f: 202-742-5661
e: jradel at vantage.com

"When you can measure what you are speaking about, and express it in
numbers, you know something about it; but when you cannot measure it,
when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge is of a meagre and
unsatisfactory kind; it may be the beginning of knowledge, but you have
scarcely, in your thoughts, advanced to the state of science, whatever
the matter may be." ~Lord Kelvin



Kyle Ackerman wrote:
> Mr. Plzak,
>
> Many of us would have to agree that Dean Anderson can be outright
> annoying.  He appears to have a significant amount of time to pursue
> angles and details that many of us would never consider nor take the
> time to discuss.  While I can't say I agree with his approach, nor do
I
> condone his "soapbox" approach, do you or we have the right to
restrict
> his First Amendment rights?  Is there really proof that he has
violated
> the ARIN AUP or is "someone" just tired of reading his emails?
>
> We live in a country where people can burn flags, where protesters can
> waste considerable time and money, where we have the right to voice
our
> opinion.  Like it or not, these are things that are part of our
American
> foundation.  I am not a supporter of Dean's tirades but I AM a
supporter
> of our U.S. Constitution and the right to voice an opinion.  There are
> others on the list that have seen merit in some of the concerns that
> Dean has outlined so it appears that, at the very least, some of the
> members are benefiting from this discussion.
>
> I would like to request a clarification, for the sake of Dean's First
> Amendment rights as an American citizen, on how he violated the
current
> list AUP.  I realize that the list is not a public forum for
> "soap-boxing" and that you have the right to censor certain
> discussion... But... is this REALLY what we want to set as a
precedence
> for future topical discussions?  If the discussion gets ugly do we
want
> to simply "turn off" those that disagree with our viewpoints?
>
> Dean obviously has a mission and is passionate about certain things.
> Some would say "way too many things".  But, again, have we unfairly
> censored his right to participate in this organization?  You mentioned
> that he was "blacklisted" for the following reason:
>
> "untrue and per se defamatory posting alleging criminal activity."
>
> Could you please provide some supporting details on this?  I am
> embarrassed to admit how much time I have spent reading the
submissions
> to this list in the past 6 months.  But, the one thing that I do
notice
> is that Dean typically supports all of his claims and/or discussions
> with information that can be verified as factual (or not).  If he
> chooses to risk a lawsuit for defamation and/or character damage,
isn't
> that his risk and not ARIN's?  Unless you have proof that the
> information he has posted is untrue, isn't he innocent until proven
> guilty?
>
> If you can truly support your allegation listed above, then I will
> support your decision 100%.  If not, shouldn't we consider Dean's
right
> to free speech?  I'd be interested to hear what the other members
think
> on this topic.
>
> Regards,
>
> Kyle
>
> Kyle Ackerman
> Founder
> Xtratyme Technologies, Inc.
> "Home of the Blueprint America Program"
> www.xtratyme.com
> 888.987.2896 (888-XTRATYME)
>
> "We develop partnerships with individuals, groups, businesses, and
> governmental units that understand the importance of bringing good
> quality high-speed Internet access to everyone in their local
community"
>
> P.S.  What will I do for interesting reading if Dean is not available?
> Maybe he should start his own "soapbox" website???? ;)  I guess I will
> have to do REAL work today!
>
>
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